Target Water Based Finish Questions

[rhagen]

OK, I know from reading some of the posts here that some of you guys use Target water-based products. I'm planning on using the EM6100 gloss lacquer on my OOO-28 kit.

I have a mahogany neck that I want to stain/fill dark, to more closely match the rosewood body.

What should I use for pore filler? I have some of the HSF 5100 clear pore filler, and some dark walnut trans-tint dye. Can I use that combination to make a dark pore filler?

What about stain for the neck wood? I've read that water-based stain is best because it causes less problems if you accidentally sand through during the finishing process. I have some of the Target EM1000 sanding sealer. Could I add trans-tint to that and use it as a stain/sealer, then fill the pores with the tinted HSF5100?

I guess I need to go out and buy some mahogany so I can do some testing to see what will work.

Rick

[Ken C]

Rick,

You can tint HSF5100, though I never have. I would definately experiment on something else first. HSF will leave a film in the pores or on the surface that will prevent the underlying wood form accepting stain. So if you want to use HSF, you really need to stain first or tint your HSF5100. If you stain first, be careful not to sand through or you'll end up with light spots. Your thought of tinting sanding sealer or even EM6000 will also work. I have used tints in my EM6000 a fair amount. I like them for evening out color or adding some depth to the finish.

You can also use your tints diluted in denatured alcohol or water. I have used them diluted in water and applied directly to the wood. Again, I would do this prior to pore filling. Note that water will raise the grain, so I typically run a damp cloth over the wood, let dry, then sand to 320G or so. I may do this a couple of times prior to actually applying the tint. I do this as using the tint diluted in water will raise grain. Then once the wood is stained, you can't remove the nibs without lightening your stain. When you are ready to apply the tint, use a damp cloth to moisten the wood first. This will allow you to better control how much tint the wood absorbs and help reduce the chance of getting splotches. I follow this same approach with using water based stains.

If I plan on staining a neck, I usually pore fill with Pore O Pac, which can be tinted but also accepts stain very well. This allows me to fill pores until I know I have them 100% full, final sand, then stain without fear of sanding through later.

Ken

[rhagen]

Ken,

Thanks for replying.

I did some tests, tinting both the sealer and the HSF. I liked the results with the sealer better. I also did as you suggested and added the tint to water, and to alcohol, with similar results. I used the trans-tint dark walnut but don't really like the color - no warmth. I also have some amber and may experiment with a mixture to get a tone I like.

I wanted to use pore-o-pac, since it is recommended here a lot, but can only find natural. What can be used to color it?

Also, Behlen's also makes a waterbased pore filler besides pore-o-pac, do you know of anyone who has used it?

I need to get moving on this. The guitar has been sitting ready for two weeks while I'm trying to come up with a finishing plan. A lot more intimidating than finishing a piece of furniture!

Rick

Rick

[Ken C]

Rick,

The water based Pore o pac is what I use. It flashes more quickly than the solvent based filler, so you have to keep an eye on it, but I find it works reasonably well. You can tint the water based filler with any number of things, including your Transtints dyes. I have also used my wife's acrylic paint to tint this filler, which works just fine.

When finishing darker colored woods, I often shoot a base coat of amber shellac or amber tinted EM6000 prior to shooting the clear topcoats. The amber does add a touch of warmth as well as some depth to the finish.

Ken

[tippie53]

I use pore o paq but use the mineral spirit based . I use minwax or any mineral based stain . I only mix a small amount and use naphtha to help with the flash time . Filling is the foundation of the final finish . Work on this and find the technique that works for you .
This is a case of technique and product mating for you . My best advice is to practice on a piece of wood first then try it on the guitar . Fill , check the result and when you think it looks good , do it 2 more times .