Help! Broken binding and cracked top

[nkwak]

Long story short, this is my third build and I messed up the herringbone purfling and maple binding by sanding through it with a palm sander. I could’ve spliced in a section of new herringbone and a section of binding but instead opted to go the overkill route. What happened next was that the router bit into the guitar and in my surprise I dropped it on concrete. Here are the gory pictures:

IMG_0172.jpeg

IMG_0173.jpeg

As you can see, the binding and purfling is now toast more than halfway round the guitar and 2” of the top is damaged. It looks like the binding at the tail block took the worst of impact but it pushed the top up and made some clean cracks. If I had to guess I’d say the lining (Spanish cedar from Martin) broke away from the side. The sides (black walnut) are intact; there is no key crack.

Can this be fixed? If so, how intrusive would a repair be?

PS: I have an idea but it’s probably not a good one, which is why I’m posing the questions here.

FWIW I have an idea, but I’m not sure it’s a good one.

[tippie53]

ok
first off your lucky you didn't get hurt. I think you did a climb cut and this got away from you.

So please be safe with these tools. So yes you can fix it but here is the A B C list
check inside to see where the braces got loose.
so you will have to address these all at one time. Locate and prep the braces first. Get as much of the old glue off as you can , Take 150 grit paper cut is strips and run it so you sand off the glue on both surfaces. Then FIgure out how your going to clamp this down. Deep throat clamps but follow me on this.
Find something smooth like formice or uhmw nylon. Apply glue to the braces , and cracks then clamp using the plastic caul on the top. Plan ahead so you have the right clamps. If you have to make clamps make Plywood Cs and use wedges to tighten. so make them more like a G see the G leg will work around the braces and help flaten the top on the length cracks and C clamps on the braces

[nkwak]

Thanks, John. The stinker of this is that I was just about done when the bit dug it. It actually didn't tear into the guitar; I was just so nervous that I literally dropped the guitar. Chalk it up to having the yips.

EDIT: for reference, I working incrementally in depth and was to the point where I was just trying to skim off a piece of white purfling. In hindsight, this was something I could have done with a chisel.

IMG_0171.jpeg

I have one further question though:

Do I need to take the top off, or can I just do "orthoscopic surgery?" I'm thinking that I need at least to rout away that chewed up binding and purfling.

[Skarsaune]

I have one further question though:

Do I need to take the top off, or can I just do "orthoscopic surgery?" I'm thinking that I need at least to rout away that chewed up binding and purfling.

Ouch! I hate that happened to you.

You can do surgery and get the top cracks & braces sorted like John said. Do this before you do any more routing of the binding/purfling.

You could, alternatively, take the top off. At that point, you could repair or completely replace the top. Taking the top off could cause more damage to the top.

[Stray Feathers]

As John says, the good news is you were not hurt. The second thing is, don't beat yourself up about it. You're not the first person this happened to. And this is your third instrument - you know you have some skills to get through it. I have not experienced your dilemma, but I have made my share of goofs, and I'm not too happy leaving them. If it were my guitar, I would rout off the bindings and replace the top. There is a cost of course, but it may make the repair faster and cleaner and less stressful for you. You may even be able to unglue the braces with the top removed, and clean them up and reuse them. That's one man's opinion . . . Bruce W.

[carld05]

I agree with the recommendations to replace the top. The cross grain breaks seen in the photo in your other post will always show. Bummer!

[tippie53]

may I suggest you fix it first as this is a learning opportunity if you happy with the repair burst it if not replace the top. While replacement is best if your selling it. In my early days I always took mistakes did what I could to fix as this helps that skill set then take then off and replace

[nkwak]

Thanks, John. This one isn't going to get sold but I'd like to have something for a potential commission to demo off. I have three people who've shown an interest.

I'm thinking that I am going to rout the broken bit of binding off and get a look at the lining underneath. I've had sections of lining pop off on my first build and am hoping that that's just the case here. Spanish cedar likes to chip, just like that curly maple did. I imagine that once I have it exposed I'll have to do some dental work on the lining in order to keep it from pushing the top up. We'll see.

If the top is toast, I have another sitka top and another rosette and a spruce billet for braces that I was planning to use on my next build. The top on this one is flat but I just ordered a 60' radius dish from you so if I do take the top off I can always go back and sand in a radius. I'd prefer not to though. I just got the neck angle where I wanted it and retopping this one would throw all that hard work away.

Lesson learned: on noncommissioned work learn to live with the warts and put all that energy into future builds.

[Bob Gleason]

I have a completely different take on this. One that people usually don't want to hear. Plenty of things like this happen to even those of us who have a lot of experience. Replacing a top is a serious matter. Chances of getting the guitar back to the proper geometry and shape are not good, and it can turn out to be an unsatisfactory experience. The sides have already been sanded to thickness, so there is very little working room to clean up new binding.Personally, when things go this far South, I just start over. In my experience, even if the project gets finished and plays O.K., it just never comes out the way it should.I don't even keep the parts. They don't make a very good souveneir. If you decide to go ahead with the repair, I would say view it as a learning experience and don't expect too much success. Just my take. Good luck with your project.-Bob

[Diane Kauffmds]

I had a similar setback with my #2. I finally rebooted after the binding router jig suddenly allowed the bit to cut too far into the upper bout. It can be disconcerting when a tool suddenly does the unintended.

It presents an opportunity to learn repairs. In the meantime, I understand restarting. That's what I did