How to get more overtones and responsiveness from a guitar?

[koolimy]

Hi, do y'all have any advice on what one needs to do to make a guitar that is more responsive to a light touch? And how to make a guitar with more overtones?

I finished a Red Spruce/Cherry J-185 kit from Blues Creek in the summer and I LOVE it, but the guitar is kind of like a nice Gibson guitar, slightly dry and warm, and really good with strumming. I have always liked fingerstyle guitars that have a lot of overtones, and was wondering if it is possible to build such a guitar myself, possibly for my 2nd kit.

[MaineGeezer]

It's certainly possible. Exactly how to achieve that desirable state is another question.
In no particular order or relative importance, I'd aim for:

A responsive soundboard. One that when you tap the blank, it rings like a bell, with no hint of a thump. A few years ago I went to Rare Woods UISA in Mexico, Maine, and was able to pick through their stacks of soundboards. I happened to come across one set that sounded particularly good to me. Unless you can go to a place like that, you're probably stuck with whatever somebody sends you.

Make the sides, back, and top as thin as you dare, and use lightweight bracing. Ideally, the guitar should not quite collapse from the string tension.

Use a thin finish.

You might try building something like a Martin OM, which seems to be a very well-balanced guitar.

Whether any of that would help, I don't know.

[koolimy]

It's certainly possible. Exactly how to achieve that desirable state is another question.
In no particular order or relative importance, I'd aim for:

A responsive soundboard. One that when you tap the blank, it rings like a bell, with no hint of a thump. A few years ago I went to Rare Woods UISA in Mexico, Maine, and was able to pick through their stacks of soundboards. I happened to come across one set that sounded particularly good to me. Unless you can go to a place like that, you're probably stuck with whatever somebody sends you.

Make the sides, back, and top as thin as you dare, and use lightweight bracing. Ideally, the guitar should not quite collapse from the string tension.

Use a thin finish.

You might try building something like a Martin OM, which seems to be a very well-balanced guitar.

Whether any of that would help, I don't know.

Thanks for your reply. Of course like everything in life we look for a simple answer to our questions but we are presented with the reality that nothing is simple! It seems like making a responsive fingerstyle guitar with lots of overtones is something that every guitar builder wants to do, and it takes tons of expertise, skill, and risktaking to build such a guitar. I'm guessing that certain style guitars are better for overtones than others (i.e. Martin styles are better than Gibson for overtones), and certain tonewoods are also better than others (i.e. Rosewood better than Mahogany), but as you said there's a lot more to consider and it's not as simple as just building this guitar w/ these tonewoods and with this type of bracing, etc., LOL.

[Stray Feathers]

Remember too that your guitar is new, and will change as it matures. My first guitar is an OM 12 fret, western (bitter) cherry with a Sitka (I think) spruce top that was quite old and dark when given to me, and it's had four years now and continues to surprise me when I play it. One resource I've found useful is the Tonewood Data Source, a non-commercial compilation of opinions from many people on a huge number of tonewoods:

http://tonewooddatasource.weebly.com

Bruce W.

[koolimy]

Remember too that your guitar is new, and will change as it matures. My first guitar is an OM 12 fret, western (bitter) cherry with a Sitka (I think) spruce top that was quite old and dark when given to me, and it's had four years now and continues to surprise me when I play it. One resource I've found useful is the Tonewood Data Source, a non-commercial compilation of opinions from many people on a huge number of tonewoods:

http://tonewooddatasource.weebly.com

Bruce W.

Thanks for your reply. I thought that my guitar already settled in to its sound because it shifted quite drastically during the first few weeks. It started out having a very overtone heavy, bass heavy, sound with soft and smooth trebles, and it was quiet when played softly. The overtones dried up and the trebles became louder, and it also became a bit louder when played softly. Does a guitar change its sound even after it has settled in for a few months?

[Skarsaune]

Does a guitar change its sound even after it has settled in for a few months?

They will change for quite some time as they break in/get played in.
The most dramatic changes are the initial ones you have noticed.

[koolimy]

Does a guitar change its sound even after it has settled in for a few months?

They will change for quite some time as they break in/get played in.
The most dramatic changes are the initial ones you have noticed.

I see. It's good to know that it will continue to change for a while. Hope it keeps changing for the better and doesn't get worse! I'm guessing that it won't get more overtones, although the guitar may become more responsive.

[bftobin]

There's many factors in getting the sound you want. The top, the size and the scale length, are the main ones, in my experience, any top with the right characteristics is a great start, but I'd recommend Engelmann to start. In general, it has lots of overtones but not a lot of fundamental or headroom. The OM/OOO shape is very good, or even a OO. You'll find many fingerpickers will use a 24.9 scale. There are many options, but this is a good place to start.

Brent

[koolimy]

There's many factors in getting the sound you want. The top, the size and the scale length, are the main ones, in my experience, any top with the right characteristics is a great start, but I'd recommend Engelmann to start. In general, it has lots of overtones but not a lot of fundamental or headroom. The OM/OOO shape is very good, or even a OO. You'll find many fingerpickers will use a 24.9 scale. There are many options, but this is a good place to start.

Brent

Thanks for your advice. So if I want to build a 2nd guitar that's more for fingerstyle and has more overtones, I should probably look in the direction of a OM/000 or 00, and maybe try to find a top like Engelmann spruce? And 24.9 may be more suited for overtones and more responsive playing? I have been interested in the 000 12 fret for some reason, maybe that should be something I look for in my 2nd kit.

[MaineGeezer]

I like the OM-style guitars I've built. Of course, the person behind the guitar has a lot to do with how it sounds; ref: Doc Watson fingerpicking his Gallagher draeadnought. But most of us ain't Doc Watson! Or this guy, playing a Gibson, I think: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbFS3iQPxig And Dave Van Ronk played a Guild.

I think guitars keep changing for a long time. There is that initial settling-in period when all the pieces get used to being a guitar, but it keeps going. You may not notice it week to week, or even month to month, but you'll pick it up sometime and notice a change. I was playing my first guitar that I built 5 or 5 years ago, and noticed that the sound seemed richer than I remembered.

I've just started a guitar to be built entirely of Port Orford cedar that I hope will resonate spectacularly... we'll see.