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 Post subject: Toner Question
PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:46 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 11, 2018 4:17 pm
Posts: 38
So I am thinking of doing a kit guitar Mahogany back and sides with a Adi. top. I will be using Aqua coat for pore filling and Tru-Oil. I don't want the top to look like white or new looking. I want it to look like it's a old guitar, so my question is what should I use for a toner? I am guessing toner first then Tue-Oil for the top. I know I would not pore fill the top. Just looking for a old look.


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 Post subject: Re: Toner Question
PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:04 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:50 am
Posts: 678
Location: Chadds Ford, PA
I haven't done this, but I would think you are right. Seal, toner, then drying oil. I've been tempted by the Stewmac toners and I know orange shellac would have an aging-like effect. Sealing the top first and not cutting thru that would be important. Love to see what you decide and do.


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 Post subject: Re: Toner Question
PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:15 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 11, 2018 4:17 pm
Posts: 38
Not sure what you mean by seal first. Seems like it would not take the toner??


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 Post subject: Re: Toner Question
PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:42 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:50 am
Posts: 678
Location: Chadds Ford, PA
I was thinking that the toner might not be absorbed by the spruce evenly and to get an even color sealing would be necessary. This is something that is done when staining softwood like pine to avoid the blotchy effect.


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 Post subject: Re: Toner Question
PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:56 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 11, 2018 4:17 pm
Posts: 38
Yes you are right, but then again I think once you seal something nothing is going to get through that. I would get everything ready and soak a pad pretty good but not heavy and hit it real quick and then wipe it off quick so that everything was uniformed. The top is not that big and it would only take seconds and then let it dry and forget it. A quick on and off.


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 Post subject: Re: Toner Question
PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:47 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2012 9:49 pm
Posts: 327
Time to test on scraps until a good result can be replicated. My advice to OP is to put the guitar body away until he is dead sure that he will like the results he got on the test panels.

I had occasion once of trying to get an even color from a lacquer with dye mixed in atop a sealed fabric surface. Never again. I am guessing that putting toner atop a sealed surface might also be its own similar nightmare. And tops won't tolerate sanding to clear away a mistake.

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peter havriluk


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 Post subject: Re: Toner Question
PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:25 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 11, 2018 4:17 pm
Posts: 38
I have not even started on it yet, just getting ideas. One of my main things is what stain or dye would I use to get that vintage look.


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 Post subject: Re: Toner Question
PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 6:41 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 7:09 pm
Posts: 6198
Location: Hegins, Pa
toner isn't a stain it is added to the finish to make it look older
you can use artist tempra and it doesn't take much
so
A fill
B seal
C apply a coat or 2 without toner
D now add a touch of color and apply

it doesn't take much so take your time you can add more as you go but start light and work up to the color you want
I would use some scraps to color adjust

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John Hall
Blues Creek Guitars Inc
Authorized CF Martin Repair Center
president of Association of Stringed Instrument Artisans
http://www.bluescreekguitars.com


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 Post subject: Re: Toner Question
PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 10:03 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 8:13 pm
Posts: 2283
I've had to make new tops look older on old guitars. Spruce doesn't absorb dyes or chemicals evenly.

I mixed a 1/2 pound cut of shellac. I washed the spruce top with a light, single coat of the shellac wash. Then I used Butyl Acetate to "age" the spruce.

Please note that Butyl Acetate isn't a chemical to be treated lightly. You should wear gloves, as well as eye and respiratory protection.


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 Post subject: Re: Toner Question
PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 10:31 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:03 am
Posts: 1354
Location: Chestertown Maryland
Shellac comes in many different "colors" from blonde (almost clear) to garnet (pretty orangey) you could mix up a batch of, say 3-4 lb cut of garnet, wipe a few coats on a cut-off from the top, see if you like it, then dilute from there and try again. Very controllable, no spray equipment, and easily reversible if you mess up.

Ed


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