Waterbased lacquer colour recipes

The Achilles' Heel of Luthiery
Phil
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Waterbased lacquer colour recipes

Post by Phil »

I plan to only using waterbased lacquers due to health/safety issues and so that I can spray in my basement without too much trouble. Anyways, there seems to be information on mixing colours with nitro lacquer, but its more difficult to find info on mixing waterbased lacquers. Maybe I'm over thinking this - would the recipes be basically the same?

I'm working on a maple L-O which I want to sunburst, and I'm also working on a Les Paul build which I want to spray a burst too. I've purchased EM1000 sealer and EM6000 lacquer. I'm using ColorFX dyes that I purchase at http://www.woodessence.com/ColorFX-Dye- ... 46C12.aspx

I haven't really found much on the Target Coatings forum either, or at least not too much on specific guitar colours.

Any suggestions would be great.
B. Howard
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Re: Waterbased lacquer colour recipes

Post by B. Howard »

If you are looking for how to create a specific color as used by a certain mfg you will most likely be out of luck. I mix all my colors by eye. When it comes to burst finishes you will find that examples from any mfg. are not all that consistent when compared side by side. That is due to the many variables encountered form actual color mix to application thickness. The one draw back to most water based systems IMHO is that the toners need to be done in the sealer rather than the topcoats. Best practice is to prepare a series of sample panels to find the color and shading you are looking for.
You never know what you are capable of until you actually try....

Brian Howard
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Phil
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Re: Waterbased lacquer colour recipes

Post by Phil »

I guess maybe what I need is more info on how to go about mixing colours. My first kit guitar was finished clear, and then my first guitar from scratch and a couple restorations I did were black - that was easy, just mix enough black pigment in the lacquer so it was opaque! I did find some discussion on mixing the colours for Gibson cherry red so I plan to mix it like the info I found and I can tweak the colour a bit from there. That red is basically mostly red with a hint of black and blue added.

But for my acoustic I am visualizing a burst kind of like the following picture but a bit lighter:

http://www.themusiczoo.com/images/2-28- ... 2119_1.jpg


The middle I would start off with amber and I can use a little brown to darken if necessary, but I really don't know what colours I would start mixing to get that outer shade!

Another thing I am wondering.... I want to burst the top as well as the back. Is it better to dye the wood amber then spray the burst, or spray everything, or?
watergunn
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Re: Waterbased lacquer colour recipes

Post by watergunn »

I have done a few bursts but all with nitro lacquer.
My base was always an amber color.
Then i shot red mahogany from the center outward. Getting heavier as I moved outward.
Then ebony or tobacco on the outside part.

You just layer it till you get the desired darkness.

I did an ambertone burst the same way but used no ebony on it.

RG
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Phil
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Re: Waterbased lacquer colour recipes

Post by Phil »

Beautiful guitars! I like something like either the first or the last one. Nice work!
B. Howard
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Re: Waterbased lacquer colour recipes

Post by B. Howard »

Mine are nitro as well. An amber base coat made with med red mahogany and lemon yellow. The outer portion is done with a brown made with hickory. For toners I use Behlins solar lux. I think they may even be compatible with WB finishes. Generally you want as little dye in your lacquer as you can, upper limits would be 15% dye or pigment. It should be noted that would be 15% of the dry film which will be quite a bit less than 15% of the sprayable. The colors and pattern here were copied approximately from a late 30's Gibson.
IMG_3583.JPG
IMG_3601.JPG
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You never know what you are capable of until you actually try....

Brian Howard
www.brianhowardguitars.com
Taylor authorized service
Custom finishing services

Brian howard's guitar building & repair blog
http://www.brianhowardguitars.com
Phil
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Re: Waterbased lacquer colour recipes

Post by Phil »

I finally got around to attempting a sunburst. I had a couple screw-ups around the binding that I wanted to hide with the sunburst and it turned out a bit darker then I originally wanted, but overall I'm happy with it considering - 1) its my first ever attempt and 2) I'm usually a $25 spray gun and 5 gal compressor!

I finished scraping the binding this morning and will be clearcoating it over the next few days if everything goes well.

What do you think? Be nice guys, I'm no professional! :)
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watergunn
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Re: Waterbased lacquer colour recipes

Post by watergunn »

Looks awesome to me! Great work.

Rick Gunn
Ben-Had
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Re: Waterbased lacquer colour recipes

Post by Ben-Had »

Phil wrote:I plan to only using waterbased lacquers due to health/safety issues and so that I can spray in my basement without too much trouble. Anyways, there seems to be information on mixing colours with nitro lacquer, but its more difficult to find info on mixing waterbased lacquers. Maybe I'm over thinking this - would the recipes be basically the same?

I'm working on a maple L-O which I want to sunburst, and I'm also working on a Les Paul build which I want to spray a burst too. I've purchased EM1000 sealer and EM6000 lacquer. I'm using ColorFX dyes that I purchase at http://www.woodessence.com/ColorFX-Dye- ... 46C12.aspx

I haven't really found much on the Target Coatings forum either, or at least not too much on specific guitar colours.

Any suggestions would be great.
The Target forum does have that info but it is a little hard to find. I think I down loaded it a while back and will see if I can locate it. The color coats are applied with the EM1000.

EDIT: I found it. PM me with you private email and I can send you the attachment.
Tim Benware
Phil
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Re: Waterbased lacquer colour recipes

Post by Phil »

PM sent, thank you!
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