The Dreaded M&T Neck Joint

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johnnparchem
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Re: The Dreaded M&T Neck Joint

Post by johnnparchem »

tippie53 wrote:he has it right
he has a spacer at the neck and another at the saddle point of the same height, look at the heel as he has that shimmed so he can visualize the neck angle with the bridge. ...
I do understand the original picture in his first post that you describe. It is a second post picture with a spacer at the neck and saddle of the same height with a bridge and a drill bit on the bridge. As I see when the neck is dropped in and the saddle spacer is removed, the straight edge on the neck without a fretboard will project over the bridge. I can believe I am missing this but I do not understand how the bridge is involved without the fret board.
ruby@magpage.com
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Re: The Dreaded M&T Neck Joint

Post by ruby@magpage.com »

redundant

Ed
Ed M
tippie53
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Re: The Dreaded M&T Neck Joint

Post by tippie53 »

if the neck is in this position and your line is like this with the bridge and no fretboard you have the neck at the wrong spot the key is 1/16 to 1/8 in off the top in relationship to the height of the neck at the block so
say 1/4 in above the neck block you would want to be 5/32 to 3/8 off the top. Then work it down so when you place the fretboard on the neck you want to be about 1/16 off the top of the bridge with the frets in
hope this make sense
John Hall
Blues Creek Guitars Inc
Authorized CF Martin Repair Center
president of Association of Stringed Instrument Artisans
http://www.bluescreekguitars.com
Dobroguy
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Re: The Dreaded M&T Neck Joint

Post by Dobroguy »

Thanks for the videos and observations everyone. Mr. Hall is correct with his comments as my original pictures show the initial neck placement with 1/4" spacers at the neck joint and approximate bridge position. Today I spent a couple of hours whittling away (meant sanding) lowering the neck and here's the final result. The neck is not cranked right down at this point and the straight edge is parallel with the top of the bridge. It will come down some if I cranked the neck into position.


I know I'm getting ahead of myself but where do you apply glue when permanently installing the neck? Only along the pinch joint or? Is glue applied under the fretboard? Is the body finished under the fretboard or left bare for gluing? I've only used bolt on necks previously.


Best wishes for a great New Year to everyone.
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tippie53
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Re: The Dreaded M&T Neck Joint

Post by tippie53 »

glue the fretboard and dovetail but I do this after finish
John Hall
Blues Creek Guitars Inc
Authorized CF Martin Repair Center
president of Association of Stringed Instrument Artisans
http://www.bluescreekguitars.com
Diane Kauffmds
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Re: The Dreaded M&T Neck Joint

Post by Diane Kauffmds »

It's going to be pretty much like your bolt on.

You want to finish the guitar before gluing the fretboard, neck, and bridge. But, you need to either tape off, and/or scrape off all finish under the areas that you glue, so you have clean wood to clean wood.

You don't finish the dovetail joint, but you will want to finish the shoulders to the edge of the mortise. Your neck will be finished except under the cheeks that sit on the shoulders, and you won't want any finish where you glue the fretboard or the extension.

I don't know about anyone else, but I put a little glue under the cheeks on the neck, where it sits over the dovetail assembly. To me, it ensures a continuous line from the shoulders up the neck. I do not remove finish from the shoulders under the cheeks, although there is a little glue there, because it's cosmetic and not structural. The important area is the joint itself.
Diane Kauffmann
Country Roads Guitars
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Dobroguy
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Re: The Dreaded M&T Neck Joint

Post by Dobroguy »

With the bolt on neck guitars I built previously I never glued the fret board extension to the body. However. I did mask off under the bridge plate on all of them before gluing them. On this build I will glue the fret board extension as well.


Today I got the final fitting of the neck done and also glued on the head stock veneer. Other than a final sanding and making the nut & bridge that's all I can do until warm weather arrives in the spring. I paint outside.
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johnnparchem
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Re: The Dreaded M&T Neck Joint

Post by johnnparchem »

Dobroguy wrote:With the bolt on neck guitars I built previously I never glued the fret board extension to the body. However. I did mask off under the bridge plate on all of them before gluing them. On this build I will glue the fret board extension as well. ...
Good move gluing down the extension. I think the extension is a good brace in a place where the guitar is most likely to fold up under string tension, why leave unglued. Although I have heard people arguing that it is not necessary and a little backward tension from the frets can hold the extension on the body, Still I always viewed it as part of the structure; imagine the neck pulling forward under string tension, with the extension not glued it just slides forward providing little support, glued down it acts as a wide 6 mm hard wood brace resisting the string tension and tying the neck to the upper transverse brace.
tippie53
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Re: The Dreaded M&T Neck Joint

Post by tippie53 »

gotta agree you should glue the extensions down .
John Hall
Blues Creek Guitars Inc
Authorized CF Martin Repair Center
president of Association of Stringed Instrument Artisans
http://www.bluescreekguitars.com
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