Headstock Thickness and Inlay Question

[Darryl Young]

I glued a rosewood headstock veneer on the neck several months back after shaping the headstock of the neck. I didn't think at the time that it would be easier to inlay the veneer before gluing it to the neck. The headstock with veneer is currently 0.650" thick. Do you see any issues if I use another veneer right on top of this one? It will make the headstock 0.712" thick (before sanding). I am using Gover StaTite open back tuners which have a fairly long shaft (0.835" to the center of the string hole). If I lay the extra veneer on the headstock and place the baseplate against the back of the headstock with the tuner shaft up against the side of headstock then slide the top bushing/ferrule down the shaft flat against the extra veneer......there is still some of the flat portion of the shaft protruding above the ferrule. This wouldn't change the string angle as the hole in the shaft didn't move. Sound ok?

I inlayed the extra veneer I plan to glue on my headstock. I have problems seeing the line when I use a pencil to draw around the inlay. Not enough contrast between a lead line and the dark rosewood I guess. So I decided to try masking tape over the veneer so the pencil line would show better. This was great......till I started routing. The tape rolls up around the blade and the sticky side collects the loose dust from the cutter. After a little cutting it's difficult to see the line on the other side of the web your cutting out. After the first pass I had to pull all the tape away and retrace around the inlay. Worked out ok, but not great. I won't use the tape method again but paper might work ok, not sure. Most of my error comes from not being able to keep the inlay perfectly still while I trace around it.

Any problem with just using CA to glue the inlay to the EIR veneer. There are a couple of places where I left a little gap. Should I sand some rosewood into these gaps then hit with thin CA or should I just fill the gap with medium CA? I was thinking of glueing the inlay to the veneer before glueing the veneer to the headstock......sound reasonable? The depth of the inlay is approximately the same as the depth of the veneer so in a few place the routed channel goes all the way through the veneer. I'm afraid if I glue the veneer to the headstock first, some of the glue may squeeze through these opening and then I couldn't get the inlay all the way down.

Here are a few pics including one with a shot of the die grinder I bought from John Hall to cut the recess for the inlay (works great). I used the "bob up and down like a sewing machine" method to cut around the outline of the letters and that seems to work well.

Tape in place and lines drawn to positon the inlay:


After the first pass. Note that I have other veneer sheets surrounding the one I'm working on (same thickness) to keep the die grinder base level.


And here is the finished product (inlay not yet glued in veneer). Not sure how well you can see the inlay.......ok but definietely not perfect. You can also see the die grinder I bought from John.

[johnnparchem]

That looks real good, Looks like a hard inlay to route. You must have seen the line to get that close.
I just routed out my inlay today in rosewood, I used 5 minute epoxy with some burnt umber color added. The burnt umber was a nice match in color.

I used pencil but was taught if you hit the pencil line from the side with a desk lamp it jumps out as it shines the light back. I also have a little fish tank air pump that blows away all of the dust.

[Ken C]

Darryl, I think those tuners are the ones with the press in bushings, correct? You might be okay, but I have never had a headstock that thick. I probably would have just cut the inlay into the veneer already on the headstock. That little router you have will easily handle an inlay directly into the headstock.

The key with making those pencil lead lines on dark wood stand out is having good lighting. Under the correct lighting, a lead pencil line will almost glow.

I use black tinted epoxy when gluing inlays. Many use CA. Just make sure if you use CA that you are careful with the accelerator, so you don't end up with white instead of clear glue lines.

Ken

[naccoachbob]

I would glue the inlay to the veneer first. The inlay for my current build was done by Jimmi Wingert. I just sent her the veneer. She inlayed it, then sanded it flush. You can see some of the inlay from the back of the veneer, so there's no problem if that happens. Just make sure the back side is sanded flush.
I would think most inlay artists glue the inlay to the veneer prior to scribing the outline, as this adds much stability. It's easily removed with a razor blade. With a signature like you have, you would need to be very careful and sparing in the use of the glue.
Looks really good to me how you did it.
Bob

[Darryl Young]

Darryl, I think those tuners are the ones with the press in bushings, correct? You might be okay, but I have never had a headstock that thick. I probably would have just cut the inlay into the veneer already on the headstock. That little router you have will easily handle an inlay directly into the headstock.

The key with making those pencil lead lines on dark wood stand out is having good lighting. Under the correct lighting, a lead pencil line will almost glow.

I use black tinted epoxy when gluing inlays. Many use CA. Just make sure if you use CA that you are careful with the accelerator, so you don't end up with white instead of clear glue lines.

Ken

Yes, these tuners do have the pressed in bushings. So far, I haven't been able to get the lead pencil lines to "glow". Maybe the angled lighting mentioned above is the key.

Is accelerator required to get CA to set in rosewood? I hadn't planned on using it. Would a black tinted glue (CA or epoxy) look better around the gaps than a clear?

[Ken C]

I am guessing that under finish, clear will look pretty much like black if you can keep light sawdust and bubbles away. When I inlaid the madrose fingerboard I did use CA and sawdust, which seemed to work pretty well. Practice on some scrap pieces and go the route you like best.

Ken

[Kevin Sjostrand]

Darryl,
I think that looks really good. I say, touche! I have yet to try and inlay. My headstock inlay only requires routing out a circle.
I would use sawdust and epoxy to fill the voids. I have good luck with this on knife handles on all types of wood.

Kevin

[Darryl Young]

Well, I followed John's inlay glue tecnique he shows in his video using CA, permanent marker (Sharpie), and CA accelerant to glue my "young" inlay in tonight. It worked pretty well. Since I'm using rosewood instead of ebony, I used brown permanent marker and just a little purple to color the CA. Here are before and after pics so you can see how it did. Note the gaps in the first picture I was trying to fill and then see what it looks like after glueing and sanding.

Before:

Small_Inlay_Closeup.JPG

And after:

AfterGlueSmall2.JPG

[Tony_in_NYC]

I am not fooled by your trickery Mr. Young!
The "after" picture is obviously a different piece of wood!! I can tell by the different coloring!
I am certain its not simply an effect of the flash being on and off in the different pictures!

Nice job! If I didnt see the before picture, I would have thought you had cut the pocket perfectly! Thats a great fill job you did there. I dont have the patience for that kind of intricate inlay. Well done.

[Darryl Young]

Let me correct a measurement listed in my first post. The headstock is 0.550" thick with the first veneer glued in place......not 0.650". Sorry about that misleading info.

I sanded the first rosewood veneer down enough that laying the second veneer on top (the one with the inlay) the total headstock thickness is 0.585". It will likely be slightly thicker when I add glue. Anyone see any problem with a headstock thickness of 0.585" - 0.590"? Seems it should work fine with the Gover Sta-Tite tuner shafts.

I'm hoping to get some feedback from someone who has built a few guitars before I glue the other headstock veneer in place.