Engelmann/Honduran Mahogany Dreadnought build

[naccoachbob]

I'm just getting started on my fourth guitar. The first was totally from a kit from StewMac. It came out too tight for me. I'm sneaking in from time to time and shaving the X braces to try loosening it up. The second was for my daughter and came from KMG. The neck got all wonky as far as mating with the top because of a misunderstanding on profiling the top. I will scrap that body some time and keep the neck. It has special meaning to me. The third was for my son, and it really sounds nice. Everything came from a Martin kit that a married couple sold to me so cheaply that it wasn't funny. They had no time to build a guitar. I got the top from Tony Costa, a Bearclaw Lutz Spruce that turned out nicely.
This one is Honduran Mahogany that I got from RC Tonewoods sometime back, and an Engelmann top just in from LMI. I'm using a number of pre-shaped parts on this, but otherwise it's not kit built per se. I got a tower binding machine from John Parchem, and am so ready to try it out. Much appreciated, John. And John Hall provided me with a bending machine for my first stab at bending sides.

Here's one of the sides as it sits on the plan sheet from StewMac. It looks like it's out of whack with the plan because I moved it to the left and forgot to put it back. It fits!



And here's the obligatory shot of one of the sides in the bender. I don't think I've seen a build yet without that shot. Oh, let me tell you. Bending sides in one of these is a snap. I'll leave that word in :). I had the easiest time. Previously, I bought 4 pieces of sides from LMI to practice bending with. I used water on the first 3, two with paper around them, one without. All 3 came out pretty rippled and wavy. After consultation with people smarter than I, I did the fourth one dry with no paper, and lower temp. It came out with a bit of waviness, but nothing that sanding won't cure. And the 2 Honduran Hog sides were pretty good.



Here are the 2 sides in one of my forms. This form was from KMG. The 2nd one, I think came from John Hall. It's modified to help with clamping, but is liable to become un-modified because it's a bear to open. There are hinges on either end with screws, so you have to unscrew one end once the body's ready to come out.





Here's a couple of pictures of the back set - not yet joined or profiled.






And finally the top. I'm having a time getting a picture that shows how white this top is. there's a ton of silking as well. Since the top is .015" thick, it needs to be thinned down pretty good. I'm going to try my hand at using a plane for this after I practice on some old pine. I'll start out sanding a little to see if the reverse side of this top looks better. It's giving a hint that it might be pretty good itself.



There is just enough waviness in the sides that although I could sand it out, I'm going to try to use braces on the sides to straighten them. I'll test this out with some of the ends that will be cut off. If that doesn't do it, I'm considering SuperSoft II or something like that to maybe work them into shape. There's no time constraint on this build, so I can wait if I have to.
I've learned a number of things on the first 3 builds.
1. Do not rush. It's easy to get excited about a part being ready, but giving in to it can be dangerous.
2. Don't say "oh, I'll fix that when it's time to finish". Fix it now. You either won't remember or it will be too late.
3. Prepare the body for a successful finish. Even on the 3rd one, I thought I'd done a good prep job. But closer inspection showed me how wrong I could be.
4. Treat the top, back, sides, neck, fretboard, etc., with care. I'd do something on the neck, then set it over on the other side of the table and then knock it into something else. I'd put the top on top of a chest, and knock it sideways into somethine else. Turn over the body, get grit or something into the top and there'd be a gash down on the lower bout. Don't even get me talking about the finishing process. Somogyi keeps a paper cover on his tops except when he absolutely has to take the cover off, or when it's all done.

My new year's resolution in June is to avoid all those bad practices and make this thing something to be happy with and proud of.
Thanks for looking,
Bob

[johnnparchem]

Looks like the side bending went well. The mahogany is gorgeous.

[Kevin Sjostrand]

Bob you are well on your way on this one. That is one beautiful top. Go slow and enjoy the process.
And remember, what Bill Cory said., "It ain't a mistake if you can fix it".
Keep posting those pics.

Kevin

[Darryl Young]

Looks great Bob! Your new work (bending sides etc.) is coming along great. Keep posting pictures.

[naccoachbob]

Thanks much.
Right now I'm trying to design a rosette for this thing. I'm captivated by the work that Ray Kraut does on his rosettes, and on his necks/fret boards. Rosettes have been creatively made at least since I've started paying attention, and his are truly that. Fret boards on the other hand are, to me, mostly run of the mill even with Vine of Life and other inlays. There are some excellent exceptions to that, and Ray's caught my eye. Just look at his web site and you'll see what I mean. Of course, he's a disciple of Somogyi, so that'll tell you something as well.
Now it's off to the garage to shape the neck and heel blocks and mess with the radius gauges.

[naccoachbob]

In the past couple of days, I've glued in the neck and tail block.



Put in all the kerfing. I used reverse kerfing just because I like the way it looks. Also, it might be a bit stronger than regular kerfing.



And this afternoon I joined the two back pieces after "candling" them. Both my wife and I looked at the two pieces from opposite sides, and then I flipped them around and we did it again. The joint should be good. The back is sitting on a granite or marble piece (I don't know what it is actually, just that it's flat) that I got for its flatness. I then used a Clamp'n Tool Guide that I bought many years ago for the right edge. I set a short piece of wood where the two edges of the back touch and rested them on that. I then positioned another straight piece of wood at the left edge and clamped it in place. After gluing both edges, I let them try to mate, and slid the piece out of the middle so that the two back pieces went down flush with the granite. I then clamped a level over the seam. Wax paper was used to keep the glue from getting anywhere but the back.



I'm going to let the back sit like that all night and start working on it tomorrow to get ready to brace it up.

By the way, are these pictures too big for anyone? If they are, I can make them a bit smaller.

Thanks for looking, Bob

[nkwak]

Looking good, Bob. I hear you about "cupping" of the sides. I hope it all turned out well. My (first) build has sides that are cupped pretty bad. I'm learning to live with it but I hear you about wanting to build something to be completely proud of.

As for the top, how goes the planing? How easy was it to get a good edge on the back? Did you use a plane as well? I recently did that in the plates of my second build. I found that as long as you paid more mind on properly setting up the plane the rest went rather quickly. It was also nice making big curly rinds of spruce and I felt so much more in tune with the thicknessing process than in using my friend's Jett drum sander. Less dusty too!

[naccoachbob]

Thanks, Neil. I started planing the top last night and took one piece from .16 to .13 inch. I kind of like it too. I'm going to do the other piece today and get them both about the same thickness so I can join them. I should have done that first. Right now I'd love to see a thickness sander!

The sides look pretty good. I see daylight at different points with a straightedge, and I intend to mark the high spots all around the sides and try truing them up better. Prior to this build I had not paid any attention to sides as to true-ness. I got away with it before, but not now. Just have to be careful as they are not very thick.

I pulled out the back from joining it last night and I can distinctly see the seam in the middle. I've scraped and sanded most of the glue off. If the seam doesn't go away, I'm going to put down a strip. I really wanted to avoid that - I find the sides to be so nice that I think a strip will spoil some of that. But, with light wood, it's harder to hide a seam. My wife and I looked at binding last night at the Zootman's site (RC Tonewoods), and they have some great looking Sycamore if you look at the 2nd page of their bindings page. It's a brownish color with a lot of figuring. I'm almost sold on that for the strip, bindings, and binding for the fret board. The strip will stop me in my tracks right now as I am waiting for purfling and other stuff for the top, and will have to order the binding.

Here's the profiled back with the inside center spruce strip.

[naccoachbob]

Last Friday, I went to Steve Kinnaird's shop with another forumite who was passing thru. Got to see some of the good work Steve and Ryan do there. I took my top and back there to show them, and Ryan and I used the thickness sanding machine they have to get the top down to really close to final thickness. Then we got to play one of Steve's guitars. Man, that thing fit my lap so well, played so well, and looked so well - Well, it did!

Over the weekend, I braced the back and profiled the braces. I put tape on either side of each brace as I glued it. At first I used some old blue tape we have here. I think it's painter's tape. It didn't come up very well (it stuck to the board and glue too much), so I switched to some of the tape I use for binding. That worked really well. Very little cleanup.



After seeing all the squeeze out from that brace, I went with less on the next one.

Here's the back after profiling the braces.



The two top segments being joined. This was before thicknessing.



And here it is after thicknessing and cutting the waste from the board.



I'm going to try Sycamore for the binding. I got 4 pieces from RC Tonewoods & Sons, and it looks really good. Very brittle though. Of course, it's dimensioned down to perfect size for me and will be handled very carefully. I also got a couple of pieces of Sycamore for using on the rear of the headstock and for the tail wedge.

Ebony will be the front of the headstock and also used as binding for an ebony fretboard. There'll be a thin strip of white between the fb and binding. I'm hoping with gold EVO frets that it will really look nice.

After work tomorrow and thru the 4th of July weekend, I'll be designing the rosette. I still don't have a firm picture in my mind of what it will be.

Question(s) for the gang here: If I want to glue purfling on the binding before I bend it, what glue should I use? If CA, can anyone help with how you put it on? I'm thinking huge mess there. If it's like Titebond, will it stay together while it's getting very hot in the bender?
Thanks for looking.
Bob

[nkwak]

So far so good, Bob. I can't wait to see what you come up with for the rosette.

As for gluing the purfling to the unbent sycamore binding don't quote me on this but I had decent results with Titebond III when I glued bold BWB purfling to EIR binding.