Acoustic guitar kit recommendation

Questions and answers for beginners. If you have a question, so do most other people.
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MaineGeezer
Posts: 1711
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:14 pm

Re: Acoustic guitar kit recommendation

Post by MaineGeezer »

Hmm. LMI seems to still sell a replacement blade and the adjustment collar but not the gramil.
I guess I'd drop them a line and ask if they wiill ever carry it again. Other thavn that I have no idea, except to make your own, Luthiers have made wood gramils forever. The result may not be as easily adjustable, but it can work just as well as a commercial one.'ll 'll l
Or look into StewMac's Dremel attachments. I found a Dremel a bit difficult to control, but it will work.

It's all hard, but getting the binding right is I think one of the more difficult things to do.



One nice thing about a gramil -- it can take several hours to screw it up, whereas with a router you can ruin it in seconds. ;-))

There have been other lists of tools posted....a search through the archives should turn up someusedpful hstuff. I know Diane has posted some really good llists, as have others. .
Don't believe everything you know.
Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
When things are bad, try not to make them any worse, because it is quite likely they are bad enough already. - French Foreign Legion
koolimy
Posts: 87
Joined: Fri May 08, 2020 3:59 pm

Re: Acoustic guitar kit recommendation

Post by koolimy »

I apologize that I was not clear about the non-standard model issue. I read here or on other forums that one should not try to reinvent the wheel, so to speak, for his first build. I'm guessing that is because there will be major differences not on any plan, such as bridge location, maybe soundhole location, and maybe even bracing. I inferred that a beginner shouldn't add any difficulty by trying to figure out all these things while building his first guitar.

If I get the long scale J-185 kit from Mr. Hall, could it have the same difficulty as building a standard (i.e. the normal short scale J-185) kit? Will Mr. Hall be able to do most of the heavy lifting for me with regards to the non-standard issues, or will I have to figure out the non-standard stuff by myself?

Thanks.
Diane Kauffmds
Posts: 3246
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 8:13 pm

Re: Acoustic guitar kit recommendation

Post by Diane Kauffmds »

Diane Kauffmann
Country Roads Guitars
countryroadsguitars@gmail.com
MaineGeezer
Posts: 1711
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:14 pm

Re: Acoustic guitar kit recommendation

Post by MaineGeezer »

John will have to answer for himself, of course, but John has said in the past that he will not let you fail building one of his kits. For that matter, the rest of us won't let you fail if you're willing to do the work. Although there there are adjustments you may need to make, compared to the other difficulties involved moving the bridge location is noise level stuff. You'll have to locate the bridge anyway, no matter where it goes.

No....it's not quite that simple. You'll need to move the bridge plate, and and that may affect the bracing, or at least the shape of the bridge plate. But it's all do-able. I say with casual confidence, not being the one who will be be doing it. I don't think you need to worry about it though. You can do it. There isn't a narrow range of acceptable desigh that if you vary even slightly from it the result will be a disaster. Yku czn vary things quite a bit and still get a decent guitar.

Thinking about it some more...get a 2nd opinion on converting short scale to long scale. I may underestimating what is involved.
Don't believe everything you know.
Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
When things are bad, try not to make them any worse, because it is quite likely they are bad enough already. - French Foreign Legion
Diane Kauffmds
Posts: 3246
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 8:13 pm

Re: Acoustic guitar kit recommendation

Post by Diane Kauffmds »

I'll interject my 2 cents, and usual lecture.

My advise to all newbies is that buy decent hand tools. I like places like Harbor Freight for clamps, hammers, hand tools that don't cut. You'll need a couple of chisels (2 are enough to get you going). Buy good chisels. If you're going to use a hand plane, get a good one.

By good, I don't mean sell a kidney. You can find decent chisels, like a 5/8" Irwin Marples Blue Chip, for under $20 at Woodcraft. There are good used chisels out there. Old Stanley's are extremely sought after. Old Craftsman chisels, many made not only in the US but in Sweden, are excellent and not expensive at all on Ebay, Etsy, or flea markets. I have Two Cherries, Kirschen, Dastra (all German) as well as a Japanese, an old Stanley, and a wonderful old set of butt chisels with the name worn off.

My point is that you can do irreparable harm to your hands if you use chisels, or other manual cutting tools, made from cheap steel that won't hold a sharp edge. Dull tools are very dangerous. You'll not only end up with deep cuts from a dull tool, you could end up like me. I had to have hand surgery on both of my hands after my first build. I bought cheap tools that kept dulling. The hand strength to power through, caused both of my thumbs to trigger and carpet tunnel so bad that I lost a lot of feeling in my hands and fingers. Plus they did an awful job of cutting, requiring a lot of sanding to correct. I'm lucky that I'm a veteran, because I had to have a different type of reconstructive surgery on both of my hands, not a simple release, and the VA did it.

So, the moral of the story is to buy 1 or 2 good chisels and a decent block plane. If you don't, at best you'll be throwing away your money, worst you'll need surgery.

I personally have found that 15mm (5/8") and 6mm (1/4") are great starting sizes. I reach for them all of the time. I also found a used Stanley, low angle, G12-220. It's a 6" low angle block plane, with adjustable mouth, but made in Sheffield, England. They don't make them there anymore. You can find one for ~$30. Search Ebay and Etsy. I own Veritas hand planes (cost: 1 kidney), but I reach for my 6" English Stanley every day.

You can never own too many clamps! This is where Harbor Freight shines. Also, they sell an orange plastic dead blow hammer for ~$12, but you can find them on sale for $6-8. It's great for all kinds of things. I use it for fretting in particular, and when setting the dovetail neck if it needs a little persuasion. It works when setting tuner grommets. It doesn't mark things up, but has enough umph to do the job.

You'll need a sharpening system for your chisels and plane iron(s). I've recently bought a FastTrack MK2 sharpening system. I have several ways of sharpening my tools, from a ln electric system, to ceramic stones with a great guide. I have to say that one of the most difficult things for new folks is learning the art of sharpening.

People like Ed, one of our members, is extremely knowledgeable when it comes to tools and sharpening. Then, there are the rest of us.

The MK2 is pretty much idiot proof, at least for this idiot! You'll maintain your edges, because it's fast to pull out, takes all of about 3 minutes, and has 4 predetermined angles and can put a micro bevel on an edge. The deluxe set, which runs $150-170, can be bought for $109 Inc shipping, from Hartville Hardware: https://www.hartvilletool.com/product/8 ... ing-wheels .

Hartville is a great place. They ship lightning fast and their customer service is nice to work with. They also sell a lot of hand tools.

I won't make a list of tools. You'll find threads with lists. I just wanted to welcome you, and give you this info. Please. Always feel free to ask any question. The only stupid question is the one unasked.
Diane Kauffmann
Country Roads Guitars
countryroadsguitars@gmail.com
Diane Kauffmds
Posts: 3246
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 8:13 pm

Re: Acoustic guitar kit recommendation

Post by Diane Kauffmds »

all of us will be here for you when you build. You won't fail.

As far as guitar specs go, you can pretty much do as you please, within reason. I build mostly short scale necks/fretboards on standard deep OM's, 00's, and dreadnoughts, with standard paddle headstocks. Small changes to a standard plan are needed, nothing terribly difficult. We can answer questions about specific changes. If you're talking scale length, then you only have to move the bridge and bridge plate. There may be a possible change of the angle of the x-bracing, just a tad, to accommodate. This isn't difficult at all. Just ask if you need help.
Diane Kauffmann
Country Roads Guitars
countryroadsguitars@gmail.com
ruby@magpage.com
Posts: 1564
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:03 am
Location: Chestertown Maryland

Re: Acoustic guitar kit recommendation

Post by ruby@magpage.com »

There will be no difference in degree-of-difficulty in an OM, a J-185, a dread, a parlor. It's all the same steps with all the same tools.

I built a very simple guitar for my first kit - binding but no purfling, no inlay, not even any dots on the fretboard. My second had herringbone on top, simple purfs on the back and dots. My third had fairly elaborate inlays and a sunburst. For my fourth, I had John bend my sides to a my own shape, and make me a neck, but I did the rest. After that, it was all me. There are a lot of satisfying tasks, but for me the two best are bending sides on a pipe, and making a neck.

Take your time and work carefully, but don't get trapped into too much thinking.

Ed

And if you are going to do the J-185, talk to me first
Ed M
phavriluk
Posts: 554
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2012 9:49 pm

Re: Acoustic guitar kit recommendation

Post by phavriluk »

About changes...Soundhole location changes, too. Fingerboard gets longer, bridge/bridge plate move, the bracing changes angle (maybe) and moves (probably). Bridge and bridge plate may get wider to preserve 'x' bracing join angle. Lots of changes. Lots of choices. Good thing about building, there's no knowing how the sound changes when that long a list of changes are done. Any idea of body thickness/taper? Is there a preference (I wish...)? Can't change just one thing when scale length changes.
peter havriluk
koolimy
Posts: 87
Joined: Fri May 08, 2020 3:59 pm

Re: Acoustic guitar kit recommendation

Post by koolimy »

I appreciate all the responses, both the encouraging and the realistic. Regarding the taper, I have found a boutique builder named John Walker who is making the long scale J-185 style guitar. He specifies 3-7/8 at the front and 4-7/8 at the back, so hopefully that helps in setting the neck angle. Of course, I don't have any information regarding the top and back radius, which might be very important in setting the action.
koolimy
Posts: 87
Joined: Fri May 08, 2020 3:59 pm

Re: Acoustic guitar kit recommendation

Post by koolimy »

I really appreciate everybody's response here. I apologize again for posting two of the same topic. I will ask the administrator if it is possible to merge these two threads, as they both contain a lot of helpful information.

I will probably definitely go gramil and chisel, as it would suck massively to destroy my guitar with one mistake!! And I appreciate the PSA about sharpening the tools. I do not want to risk surgery, especially in these times.
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