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PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 7:27 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 09, 2017 5:34 am
Posts: 49
Question is

Why do they need to tuck into kerfing?? Finger braces and tone braces do not.

I have not been able to find that answer.

Thanks

-Pat


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 7:55 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 8:13 pm
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The x-Braces take on the main load and support of the top and bridge plate; they create the radius across the top.

The transverse brace is also tucked, creating support above the soundhole.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:07 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2015 9:43 pm
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I am not really in a position to give advice, but I've read threads on OLF where many people don't tuck in the lower ends of the x braces, just the ones in the upper bout. I guess it's something that some people do and some don't.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:09 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 7:09 pm
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Location: Hegins, Pa
braces are going to fit into 1 of 3 catagories
A tonal
B structural
C anti split

braces may be of more than 1 category. I will say that you get a lot of advice on forums not all of it good. I wouldn't think of not tucking a structural brace. so I tuck the X braces and transverse all others will fall of to the ends. I know that Martin had been doing it this way since the beginning.

Certainly you may do it without tucking if you wish but I am very traditional in my building . Since the structural braces get tucked you won't have to worry about the ends getting loose .

Tone bars and finger braces are not locked and are a free brace. So there are not tucked.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:35 am 
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Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:03 am
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Location: Chestertown Maryland
I put a new back on a 1933 Gibson L-00. All of the top and back braces, including the X, were tapered to near zero thickness at the point where they hit the linings. The top and back were just glued on over the paper-thin ends of the braces. Lots of ways to do it.

Some builders recess the bridge plate under the X, making it very difficult to remove and replace.

Ed


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:23 pm 
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I replaced the top on a project guitar, before my first build. I didn't tuck the braces, or put them through the sides, as some builders do. One brace came loose in the lower left bout, so I ended up replacing the top again. I've tucked them ever since.

There are as many ways of doing things as there are luthiers. I'm sure part of the problem was a gluing problem with that first top, but I feel more secure tucking them.

I think it's extremely important to do restore a historical guitar to original specs, as Ed did with his Gibson. However, I've decided to follow Martin's lead when it comes to builds. To each his own, I guess.

It's a good discussion.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:46 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 09, 2017 5:34 am
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Yes - its a great discussion and very little on the net about it.

I can understand that if the ends are left .1" or larger then the radius of the top could cause the ends to come unglued.

Being the beginner I am I will tell you I am asking this question not only for my future information but to also determine if I attempt to fix the issue I have with the upper transverse brace at the top. I worked on that brace until it does not tuck in my attempt to get the top to close properly. The X braces are tucking as designed.

I guess I can shave the ends down to nothing on that brace.

Thanks for all of the discussion and ideas.

-Pat


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:18 am 
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lonecedar959 wrote:
Yes - its a great discussion and very little on the net about it.

I can understand that if the ends are left .1" or larger then the radius of the top could cause the ends to come unglued.

Being the beginner I am I will tell you I am asking this question not only for my future information but to also determine if I attempt to fix the issue I have with the upper transverse brace at the top. I worked on that brace until it does not tuck in my attempt to get the top to close properly. The X braces are tucking as designed.

I guess I can shave the ends down to nothing on that brace.

Thanks for all of the discussion and ideas.

-Pat


I wouldn't shave the transverse brace. It's an important structural brace and it should be beefy. You run the risk of it popping loose or breaking. If the brace is too short, and if you have enough brace material left over, I would cut a new, longer transverse.

At the very least, don't shave it.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:40 am 
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Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 10:50 pm
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Location: Seattle
I am with Diane, the transverse brace needs to be inlet into the kerfed linings as it is a major structural element to support the string load. I am confused as to why you would shave the brace down instead of increasing the depth of the rebate in the kerfed linings when trying to close the box.

Imagine if you built a home with the joists too short to tie into the walls and you instead relied on the flooring material to tie into the walls, it would not end well.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:07 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 09, 2017 5:34 am
Posts: 49
Thanks Everyone

I am going to make another transverse brace and replace it and do it right.

Last time I tried to remove a brace from the top it caused some issues that I don't want to go through again.

I'm learning.

-Pat


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