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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2016 6:22 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 8:06 pm
Posts: 2925
Location: Visalia, CA
Well sometimes you just have to buy them!
I first picked up a number 7 which is in very good condition, and is a Norvell-Shapleigh Hardware Co. plane. The best I could do thus far is place it as being made from 1901 to 1917. I think it is pretty uncommom. Looks to be made my Union for them.

Then I got the Stanley Bailey #7 and the Bailey #5, both probably Type 14's best as I can tell at this point, made between 1929 and 1930. Both in very good condition.
The guy through in the other two planes; the #4 size is a WORTH, and it is an old one....the frog is part of the base casting. I don't know if this is a good idea, but it sure is heavy and solid. Looks like there is not much surface area to support the iron though. It is in really good condition for probably being made around 1925 and has had some use.

Then the little block plane....old but no name on it unless it shows up once cleaned up. Certainly a usable little plane.
So, now what do I do with them????? I'll keep one of the #7's, probably the WORTH because it is so unique, the rest I'll have to find a home for I guess. Now WHAT am I going to tell the wife?????


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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2016 6:49 pm 
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Location: Seattle
You need to create an on line store. They seem to be coming in fast.

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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2016 7:10 pm 
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Location: Visalia, CA
Yeah, faster than I can keep up with them. I guess I could just stop looking!!


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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2016 7:04 am 
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Location: Hegins, Pa
I used to collect them I must have about 40 different wood planes. Learning to set them up is key for sure

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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2016 12:01 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:03 am
Posts: 638
Location: Chestertown Maryland
Kevin - good finds all.

The Stanley 7 is after 1933 (type 16 or later) if that lever cap is original - the kidney shaped hole started then (am I seeing right?). The wood seems to be varnished "hardwood" and not Rosewood and that would put it at '42 to '45 (type 17) wartime production. If you have another Stanley 6 or 7, check the thickness of the cheek casting - usually the Type 17 is a heavier casting, but not always. They tended to use up parts and the markings on the bed are the same as earlier.

The block plane looks like an early Sargent copy of a Stanley 110 - clean up the top of the blade to see what is there. Razor blade, then WD-40 and a green scrubby

The Worth is an oddball - unsatisfying to use because the tote is a little crummy. Anytime you see a stamped depth adjusting yoke, best to pass it along

On the Shaplieigh 7, Stanley made them for a while. The "tell" is the brass depth adjuster nut which was unique to each manufacturer - Stanley, Sargent, and Millers Falls being the big ones. Remember that Stanley bought Union in 1920 and made Stanley planes marked Union for another 5 years or so

You are building up a formidable arsenal - now get to work and use them


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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2016 12:42 pm 
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Location: Visalia, CA
Thanks Ed, I sprayed some PB on the parts and took off the lever cap this morning on the Stanley 7. Pretty sure it is a 16, pre war, but for sure not a 14 as I thought it might be. I'm also pretty sure the wood is rosewood but I'll check that out. The knob and tote are in great shape, no cracks or chips as I first observed. The #5 is the same type.

There sure isn't much info on the Worth plane. I did find someone who says who the manufacturer was; Peck, Stowe and Wilcox, and what store sold them; Bigalow & Dawes Co. They also made them later with a stamped steel frog, but this one is part of the casting. I might spruce it up and keep just to display as something unique, or may pass it on to my uncle.

The Norvell-Shapleigh I'm going to clean up and keep. The adjusting lever has the "twisted" end which should make it a Union. The iron AND the rubber tote are marked "Norvell-Shapleigh", so that is why from the little info out there it seems to be made betweeen 1901 and around 1915 or so, as after that they changed the name to Shapleigh Hardware Co. Is this correct?

I don't need two #7's so I'll probably pass one of them along, leaning toward keeping the Shapleigh.

I appreciate your insight on all this Ed, it is good to know someone who has some knowledge and background with these old planes.


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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2016 12:56 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 8:06 pm
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Location: Visalia, CA
Ed, the other thing that has me a little confused on the Stanley 7 is in the Type Study, it says on the Type 15 the "Bailey" is now cast behind the knob, and "made in USA" is behind the frog. On this the Bailey is still in front of the knob and Made In USA is behind the knob, same on the #5. So I'm confused about that.
The lever cap is plated. I haven't pulled the knob and tote to see what the bolt/screw arrangement is. There is a frog adjustment screw.

Also, the adjustment knob is brass and is the larger knob, which does place it pre-war, doesn't it?

The casting is heavier than the Shapleigh #7 but I don't know if it is what would have been made wartime.


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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2016 3:43 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:03 am
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Location: Chestertown Maryland
Kevin

Sounds correct on the Shapleigh - the totes were unique.

Stanley made plenty with a twisted lateral - the Keen Kutters - even their Bedrock clone single "K"'s - the Stanley Defiance and Victor from the 30-50's, the Winchester, Monkey Ward, Sears (Fulton), and even the Unions they made all had the twisted lateral. They didn't give anybody their 2 piece lateral and they made planes for dozens of people. These planes are usually an exact copy of the Stanley version with no markings anywhere except for on the blade.

The brass nut got big in 1919 with the Type 12 and is much preferable IMHO. I have a couple of Type 11 with the low knobs that are fun, but I have replaced the brass nuts with the bigger ones which are easier to use. I sneak up on a setting easier with the big wheel.

The Stanley on the lever cap happened in 1925, Type 13 and I have a couple that are not plated, and one that has the background of the logo japanned. The others are plated with orange. I have one in red on an S-4, a folded steel plane with a malleable iron lever cap, so I think the red is to distinguish this feature. I think that all of the no plating and the japanned ones were early in this period, maybe just a few months worth. The kidney shaped slot was done in 1933, and they considered this to be so important (???) that they stamped the patent number on the blade under the logo for a little bit. I have one of these blades that has the logo and the patent date stamped on both sides - only one I have seen.

The frog adjustment screw happened in 1907, type 10, as a result of rave reviews from the first 10 years of the Bedrock that had it first.

Here is a quote from Roger Smith's (the original) type study of the bench planes:

"To maintain consistency and clarity, the illustrations used for this type study are for the #4 size only. The location and design of the bed markings vary on the other sizes and thus almost require a separate study. However, all other characteristics . . . can be used to classify other sizes."

So don't worry about the bed markings on the 7, use the other features to date it. I have a brand new Type 16 #5 bed that has a used tote and knob, and blade, cap iron and lever cap - all from a pre 1900 Bedrock. The wood is toast, the blade is used up, and the beautiful early lever cap is broken and brazed back. So no telling who switched parts somewhere down the line.

Ed


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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2016 10:58 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 08, 2013 11:39 pm
Posts: 110
I just sold a little block plane that looks like the one you bought, but newer and/or in better shape, but it might be a more recent model or knock-off. I'm embarrassed to say I don't recall any markings on it.
Bruce W.


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PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2016 11:29 am 
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Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 8:06 pm
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Location: Visalia, CA
Ed, Okay so I disassembled the Stanley #7 last night, pretty sure it is a Type 16. The tote/knob bolts are rods and brass nuts. I sanded a bit on the tote, and although it is not dark wood, it is also not blonde hardwood, and it has a sweet smell so I'm thinking it might be a light colored rosewood that had a darker stain finished applied, maybe even BR. If not rosewood, then some hardwood that is not "stained blonde" like I have seen on say, a Stanley Defiance plane. It might not be original is it may not match the knob. The knob is definitely a rosewood.
Rust on the iron/chip breaker was surface with minimal pitting and is cleaning off nicely. The lever cap is plated, with some rust, wire brushing that the plating is flaking off pretty easily, so I'll clean all the plating off. Didn't do anything with the base or frog, but they look good!

I took the iron from the little block plane to the wire wheel and there is no marking on it, and appears there are no markings on the base. This is a short little thing, so would it be akin to a Stanley 110?


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