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PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:44 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 7:09 pm
Posts: 6214
Location: Hegins, Pa
yes I use a carbide wheel on my bench grinder and a diamond dressing tip for the tormek
only take off what you need. SHouldn't have to do that very often

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Blues Creek Guitars Inc
Authorized CF Martin Repair Center
president of Association of Stringed Instrument Artisans
http://www.bluescreekguitars.com


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:57 am 
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Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2019 10:51 am
Posts: 145
Location: Fishers, IN
Tormek sells a bench grinder adapter: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002O4A2NU?pf_rd_p=ab873d20-a0ca-439b-ac45-cd78f07a84d8&pf_rd_r=J73W4BD483C17GGRCM40 and then you would need the sliding tool holder: https://www.amazon.com/Tormek-TOR-SE77-Advanced-Square-Edge/dp/B01GJXDG4I/ref=pd_cp_469_4/145-5103797-4987839?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B01GJXDG4I&pd_rd_r=ee0f8288-93bd-41a9-8a7c-2916d8244182&pd_rd_w=7w9tl&pd_rd_wg=0uvog&pf_rd_p=0e5324e1-c848-4872-bbd5-5be6baedf80e&pf_rd_r=HAT1AKGM4JKN9Q1PGHZ5&psc=1&refRID=HAT1AKGM4JKN9Q1PGHZ5 By then you're at $140, which is pricey but would save a bunch of time and you know you're working with good parts. It basically took me two weekend days to put my Dormek together, and its not "plug and play" by any means! :-)

The knockoff systems start at about $150 (Wen) and the Grizzly that John uses is $250, there is also a JET I believe. The 8" Tormek is about $430 (but attachments are needed) and the 10" is about $720. Its funny, as cheap as I am, I am so excited to have created a straight, uniform bevel on a 2" plane blade that the prices of the Tormeks, which originally made me laugh, don't seem so outrageous. Its a simple idea, basically a slow wet grinding wheel with a bunch of attachments - but to me the value is in the quality of the fixture and attachments. I think if you can get a solid system that will take the Tormek attachments (and they all seem to) it would be a good solution that you could grow into as needed.

BTW - does anyone use the leather wheel/strop? I have no experience with them, have just used fine stones for finishing. And while the finish from the 10" stone is good, its still too coarse and needs honing. I'm actually a little surprised that there isn't a second, finer stone instead of the leather wheel, on the Tormek - but maybe their wheel is better than my "Dormek" :-)

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"The difference between theory and practice is that in theory there is no difference." - van de Snepscheut


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:13 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 03, 2015 2:45 pm
Posts: 266
The cheap leather wheels and rouge they sell in the catalogs work wonders on touching up sharp edges. Usually, unless I've really damage an edge, I can put a fresh edge on the tool with the leather wheel a couple of times before reshaping in a more drastic manor. Really does a great , easy job of make a sharp edge extra sharp.--Bob


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 2:56 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 03, 2015 2:45 pm
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I should have mentioned that I meant the leather wheels that you chuck in a drill press, not ones that you have to mount on a grinder.--Bob


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:36 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 7:09 pm
Posts: 6214
Location: Hegins, Pa
I use a razor strop with rouge and they also work . Keep them clean and store so they don't bump things.
a good water stone or oil stone can dress up an edge in a hurry.
I have both leather wheels and strop so learn to use them . An old leather belt makes a good strop

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John Hall
Blues Creek Guitars Inc
Authorized CF Martin Repair Center
president of Association of Stringed Instrument Artisans
http://www.bluescreekguitars.com


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 6:55 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:03 am
Posts: 1385
Location: Chestertown Maryland
For those of us in this as a hobby, remember that a small "eclipse" style roller will get you there as accurately as any method. I have seen them for about $10 recently and I buy them when I see them at garage sales and fleas for $1 to $5.

It is pretty easy to get a square grind. You don't need to do this very often, usually when you take a nick out of the edge.

Color the back of the blade with a marker and scratch a line with an awl and a square as close to the edge as you can to get rid of nicks or just refresh. Push the edge of the chisel or plane blade straight into the grinder to make a flat face at the end of the blade right along the scratched line. This is counterintuitive the first time you do it, but it gets you a square starting point.

Now grind your angle - easy to set up a small table to get the right angle. I invested in a Lee Valley grinder support and it works great.

As you grind the new bevel, keep dunking the edge in water to keep it cool, and the the flat face of the edge thickens the metal there so that it does not overheat as easily. You can watch the little flat face on the edge as you grind and get the whole edge to come to a point all across it at the same time. One last pass over the grinder to get the bevel even.

When the flat is still there but tiny, hone at your secondary bevel, flatten and polish the back to get rid of the burr, back and forth a couple of times, and away you go.

Takes less time to do than it takes to describe it.

Ed


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2020 7:20 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:03 am
Posts: 1385
Location: Chestertown Maryland
I was in the shop today and put together a short set of shots showing how to hand grind a perfect bevel. I did this one in about 5 minutes once the grinder was set up. Then I put a secondary bevel on the edge and honed it in 3-4 minutes so that it shaved my hand.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/ruby1638/49369525146/in/album-72157712624669251/

This is an important skill but it does not have to be difficult or expensive

Ed


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2020 2:39 am 
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Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 8:13 pm
Posts: 2301
I have a sharpening sled and ceramic stones that I really like. But, after reading various comments, I realized how much time I was spending sharpening my chisels. I have 10 chisels to keep sharp, not to mention several plane irons.

I started looking at various grinders, etc., when I ran across the Wen 2900 sharpening system. It's not made anymore. But, I found a new old stock, still sealed in it's box, and picked it up for $35. The problem is that the rubber in its pump had deteriorated, something I anticipated, so I bought a submersible pump from Amazon for $5.98, and a control valve $3.99.

So, with my Rube Goldberg setup, I have a nice little sharpening system. It's fast. The tool rest has angle measurements built in. I used a piece of wood with a 90° notch in it as a rudimentary way of keeping my chisels straight, but I'm going to make something to attach to the tool rest to keep my chisels straight while grinding.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2020 10:59 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2019 10:51 am
Posts: 145
Location: Fishers, IN
Diane - great find! Yours and other comments have led to my next discovery. After reading a lot here and elsewhere re honing guides, I got a very simple one and used it over the weekend ("Eclipse" style, Atlin from Amazon) - another revelation. Fantastic to be able to hold consistent angles moving through the grits - not being able to do this prevented me from using finer stones in the past, I couldn't "feel" where I was on a 6000 water stone the way I could on a 1000 so didn't see the point, felt like all my wandering around was making things worse, not better. Now I get it, really fun to see things polish up.

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"Facts seldom sway an opinion." - John Hall
"The difference between theory and practice is that in theory there is no difference." - van de Snepscheut


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 8:24 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2014 8:13 pm
Posts: 2301
Morecowbell wrote:
Diane - great find! Yours and other comments have led to my next discovery. After reading a lot here and elsewhere re honing guides, I got a very simple one and used it over the weekend ("Eclipse" style, Atlin from Amazon) - another revelation. Fantastic to be able to hold consistent angles moving through the grits - not being able to do this prevented me from using finer stones in the past, I couldn't "feel" where I was on a 6000 water stone the way I could on a 1000 so didn't see the point, felt like all my wandering around was making things worse, not better. Now I get it, really fun to see things polish up.

Good for you. The point is that sharp tools are a must, for accuracy and safety.


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