000 first kit questions woods and black finishes

[chaliapin]

Hi all,

sorry if I am repeating questions already asked but I'm all new here.

Am contemplating my first build, I currently play a very light built, classical style(1 7/8 nut), uk luthier made, 00 sized 'parlour' (phillip Vigor) probably 40 years old, in mahogany and cedar, I love this guitar, loud, stinging treble clear bass (long scale), not too shimmery, very woody and lots of fundamental. My newer guitar is an outstanding '46 SJ which I also love in a different way, it's like playing a steam train!. I'm generally not mad about the sound of new guitars, I find rosewood on something like an om42 too shimmery and beautiful and too much sustain. I do like my friend's Martin J-15 with mahogany top. Anyway, I am intending to build a stewmac 000 but I'm considering trying to make a new mahogany top to replace the one in the kit, or adding an adirondack top or maybe even a cedar (I don't want to wait for 10 years for it to sound good!). Would I need different bracing wood for these different tops or can I use the stuff in the kit?I would like it to sound like a 1930 000-18 I played recently, that's not too much to ask is it? I also want to finish it in black with a white pickguard like a 1930's l-00, do I need to make any special considerations while building/ planning? I'm not bothered about a lovely shiny finish, can I tru-oil over paint? Lastly, I'm based in the UK so need to try to get most things I need in one order. Sorry for the long ramble but any advice would be greatly appreciated. Oh, I have basically no relevant woodworking experience but I am tenacious!
thanks all,
Mike

[tippie53]

you can use the same brace wood.

[chaliapin]

Thanks John,

this seems like a great site, I've been useful threads since I posted my question.

Would you be able to supple a 12 fret shape with a mahogany top, I was going for the Stewmac because I like a wide neck, 12 fretter and they seems to have all the tools also.

[tippie53]

yes we can do that
We can do any kit you like within reason

[chaliapin]

Oh great, thanks, well I'll continue trying to determine what top wood I would like to use as far as mahogany/adirondack/cedar goes (I guess some people will weigh in with some opinions) but I'll definitely be wanting 1 7/8 nut, slot head, 12 fret joint. Am pretty decided on mahogany BnS. If this one goes well I really want to make a nick Lucas/ roy smeck/ Jackson Browne style 12 fret gibson, perhaps in walnut but I think i'd probably better keep it on a more conventional path for my first go. I'll get in touch with a PM or whatever to finalise when I've got my final ideas sorted. I need to try to work out what tools are available in the UK and which I should get shipped over.

[tippie53]

I find that you want to use the top wood that reflects the best for the playing style.
Red is a good lead and flat picking
Sitka is versatile but can be a bit heavy
Cedar and Redwood are more woodish but have a limited capability
Engelman a great finger style
Mahogany great wood and also versatile good blues guitar
then don't forget that the bracing will also play a part
jh

[chaliapin]

hmm, it's tricky, so great to get advice from the man himself on this forum. I play a fairly strong fingerstyle and I like the limited headroom on the cedar as playing blues it gives a great slightly broken up tone when played hard in a kind of lightnin hopkins style, since I got the SJ I've been learning some flatpicking, although fingerstyle with a thumbpick sounds great too. I'm thinking mahogany or the Adirondack as I think the cedar top would be similar, but probably not as good as my current parlour style. I think my SJ has sitka but I think that expecting anything I bodge together would sound remotely like it is a little optimistic! I want to build as light as possible within reason and Adirondack is the stiffest right?

Oh, and what about volume? I like loud guitars.

Oh, and the black finish, do i mask off the white binding, spray black and then tru-oil over that?

thanks for any replies.

[tippie53]

I have to agree with Ricks Advice. Play instruments and find what you like. Know that different tops will also sound different with different bracing.

[chaliapin]

thanks guys,

I seem to find different guitars just play differently and it's more to do with the build, my sister has a large cutaway guitar made by the same luthier as my parlour but in BRW and spruce, and actually, they sound more similar than they do different. or, put another way, it's hard to get to play two identical guitars made with different woods to compare back to back. I know what guitars I've played that I like, but not what it is that makes me like them! I had a pre-war 0-17 that was really nice but I prefer my cheap ladder braced pre-war MayBell which is also all mahogany. I also like different guitars, mine are all really different but i know I don't like too much high end shimmer and I like plenty of fundamental and volume.

Is Adirondack difficult to work with? What might the upcharge be? The aesthetics of the wood don't bother me too much. Would cedar or mahogany be easier/ significantly cheaper? I understand the logic of first guitar as exercise it's hard not to feel that it's worth getting good materials when it's going to take a lot of time and effort!

[chaliapin]

Thanks Rdog, seems that Adirondack isn't worth getting for a first build, mahogany top is on the experimental side, so it's cedar or sitka? As I know I like cedar I should go with that although it's soft? Sound right to you guys?