Re-Hello

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Jim_H
Posts: 506
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2011 2:51 pm
Location: Bothell, WA USA

Re-Hello

Post by Jim_H »

Hi All. Some of you may recall my limited presence on the original kit forums. I built one of Ken's OM''s and a couple of John's kits as well.

I was fortunate enough to meet Kevin Sjostrand in person at Healdsburg in 2009.

Unfortunately I haven't been doing much building the last two years for various reasons. Settling my parents estate resulted in a change in my shop arrangements, and I had to put a lot of my bigger tools in storage. I also had some health issues slow me down (mainly a couple of back surgeries).

I did some stuff with solid body electrics during the time when the majority of my shop tools were in storage. This was fun, and I got pretty good at fretting and setups, but now I have a half a dozen strat and tele clones laying around that I don't know what to do with :p~.

I'm fortunate enough to live within short driving distance of the forum member you all know as 'runningdog' (Rick Davis - proprietor of Running Dog Guitars). I took a class with Rick a while back and built one of his 'Concert Jumbo' guitars under his tuteledge. It was an awesome experience and I learned a lot, although I've probably forgotten far too much (a refresher may be in order. ;) ).

I'm not currently building anything, but I am in the process of re-topping the OM I built back in 2007. It really didn't need it, but it was very heavily over braced and the top was way too thick and heavy. It never really opened up and is still pretty dead sounding, especially on the bass strings. There were a few other minor issues I wanted to correct as well, so I am taking the plunge. I've got the bridge removed and am currently working prepping the new top to be shaped to match the original. Once I do that I'll be taking the router to task and removing the old top. That'll be an exciting evening of fun.

For lack of anything better to follow, I'm going to try using the procedure outlined by John Greven on his site.
http://www.grevenguitars.com/GrevenGuitars.html (click "Extra's/Re-Top How To" to see his video).

Once I get the OM put back together and get it off to the finisher, I'll be able to resume the project I had started when I had to pack up the shop. I got the idea after chatting with Robbie O'Brien at Healdsburg. I have the makings (back/side sets, neck, fretboards, hardware, etc...) of three guitars, with the sides already bent in the shape of a standard martin "D" (the bending was the last thing I did before I had to shut down). I made some molds to store the sides in, and have yet to brace the tops and backs.

My project is to build all three of them side by side, with some minor differences, so I can compare them after the fact and hopefully learn something from the process. Two of the guitars will be EIR/Red Spruce, and the third will be Mahogany/Red Spruce (wood I got from John Hall several years ago now - thanks John). I think I'm going to go for making one of the EIR guitars as close to identical as possible to the Mahogany, with the back/side woods being the primary difference, and then some variation in bracing and perhaps top thickness on the other EIR guitar, then comparing the results. I have three red spruce tops I got from John Arnold that are all from the same billet, so they should be similar enough to serve my purposes. I have no background in engineering or design, and have no intention of doing any formal scientific testing.. just the ear test I guess. It should be fun and interesting. If anything useful comes from it, I'll be sure to post what I find here. If I were better at blogging and such, I'd do something online to show my work, but I know me, and I'm pretty sure it would get neglected. :lol:

Anyway, I'm blabbering again, I just wanted to re-introduce myself. I should be popping in and out of the forums once in a while (here and the OLF). I look forward to catching up with what everyone is up to, and getting my hands back on to my tools....

Jim
My poorly maintained "Blog"
johnnparchem
Posts: 2354
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 10:50 pm
Location: Seattle
Contact:

Re: Re-Hello

Post by johnnparchem »

Welcome back Jim.

John
tippie53
Posts: 7019
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 7:09 pm
Location: Hegins, Pa
Contact:

Re: Re-Hello

Post by tippie53 »

great to see you back at it.
John Hall
Blues Creek Guitars Inc
Authorized CF Martin Repair Center
president of Association of Stringed Instrument Artisans
http://www.bluescreekguitars.com
kencierp

Re: Re-Hello

Post by kencierp »

Hi Jim,
Welcome back -- man, you have some really good resources in your area!

I do recall our email exchange regarding your decision not to scallop the braces --it just seems to hold true, on at least the smaller body instruments, to get the bass response the bracing has to be "fairly to very" light.

Sounds like you have some neat projects planned -- keep in touch.
Darryl Young
Posts: 1668
Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:44 pm
Location: Arkansas

Re: Re-Hello

Post by Darryl Young »

Good to hear from you Jim.......keep us updated on your progress.
Slacker......
Ken Hundley
Posts: 608
Joined: Mon Mar 13, 2006 12:34 am
Location: Wilmette, IL

Re: Re-Hello

Post by Ken Hundley »

Welcome back! Keep us posted on your progress, sounds like a neat project.
Ken Hundley
Nocturnal Guitars
http://www.nocturnalguitars.com

So, my big brother was playing guitar and I figured I'd try it too.
- Stevie Ray Vaughan
Kevin Sjostrand
Posts: 3728
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 8:06 pm
Location: Visalia, CA

Re: Re-Hello

Post by Kevin Sjostrand »

Hey Jim!
I have wondered from time to time what happened to you, if you had just given up building.......
Great to have you come back around. The forum is a little different then before, but some of the same people are here, and many new great people are here!!!
I hope you do find time to share what you are going to be doing with us.
Is the guitar you are re-topping the one you brought to Healdsburg in 09? As I remember you had purchased one of those vibrating thingys to try and it get it to open up more/faster. Nothing wrong with replacing the top if you want to try and make it better. Share how that goes with us too.
When we met at the festival, I had only made my first kit dred and was working on my second scratch dred. I have since built 3 scratch guitars, basically one per year. Look back in the archives and you can see the last two for sure.
Hope your surgerys did what they were suppose to and you are all mended up now.
So what are you hanging around here for, get to building! :>)

Kevin
Jim_H
Posts: 506
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2011 2:51 pm
Location: Bothell, WA USA

Re: Re-Hello

Post by Jim_H »

Kevin Sjostrand wrote:Is the guitar you are re-topping the one you brought to Healdsburg in 09? As I remember you had purchased one of those vibrating thingys to try and it get it to open up more/faster.

Hey Kevin,

Yes, that was indeed the guitar. The vibraty thing (Tone Doctor or something like that) didn't really help (no surprise, I expected it to be a gimmick anyway). The guitar did open up some in the sense that the mids and trebles got a tad louder. Unfortunately, this only emphasized the deadness of bass strings. On it's own, it was a very playable guitar, but it has some pretty good company in the guitar room, and I never played it, which was kinda sad. It really just didn't hold up to the other instruments I own.

I dug up some pictures from the prior to closing the box (attached). I remember posting this picture on the old forums. Several people made nice comments about 'clean work'. Only one or two of the more experienced made fun comments like 'That's not a guitar top, it's the fore deck of a Battleship!'. haha. Unfortunately, I made the critical mistake of not getting feedback prior to closing up the box (one of the many mistakes I made).

Here is a link to the rest of the pictures. Note that they are not in chronological order.
http://gallery.me.com/jim_hansen#100022

After listening to it, I tried to do some brace shaving to loosen it up a bit, but bracing a guitar is hard enough when you do it outside of the guitar. Randomly shaving braces after the box is closed seemed futile. Also, I'm pretty sure the top was a tad on the thick side, although I'm going from memory, so I'm not positive. I'll re-measure everything once I get it opened up, and before I make the final commitment on the new bracing. I could write a fairly long chapter in a book about all of the stupid mistakes I made, and what I learned from this experience. Unfortunately it would be of no interest to anyone but me. :D

Today, I inlaid the rosette in the new top and thicknessed and routed to shape to match the original. I accounted for the binding an b/w/b purfling. I also traced out a standard X-Brace pattern, and cut and sanded the new braces. Tomorrow I will do the final pre-shaping of the braces and route the old top off. I'm thinking that's going to be exciting :D. John Greven's tutorial doesn't go into much detail about removing the brace tails from the lining, other than 'be careful'. The neck and tail blocks will be interesting too I think. I guess I'll cross those bridges when I get to them. If worse comes to worse I can drag it down to Rick's shop and appeal for guidance from Rick and Cat.

Anyway, it's a pretty good feeling making sawdust and getting to use my tools again.

I guess I should start a thread somewhere in the appropriate part of the forum if I'm going to be giving updates. :) I think I'll wait and see how much damage I do routing the old top off. If that survives, I'll take some pictures and start a thread. If it goes poorly, I'll throw it on the firewood pile and start on something else. :D
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