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Pore o pack ? Mcfaddens ?
Author
Post
longbow

Total Topics: 4
Total Posts: 74
I have'nt see much on Mcfaddens pore filler, unless I mist it. But LMI carries it and not pore o pack, Will Mcfaddens work as good as pore o pack? Will be using Mcfadden nitro for now. Can anyone help out. Thanks Dave L

Apr 03, 10 | 6:51 am
longbow

Total Topics: 4
Total Posts: 74
I just wanted to known if there almost the same thing? help... unless I missed it in a different thead. I need to make a choice soon.

Apr 05, 10 | 1:44 am
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Very similar stuff - applied the same way - check to see if it (McFadden's) can be thinned with naptha if not you, will need the correct solvent -- paste filler should not be use straight out of the can. It has to thinned to a brushable consistancy (check out the Martin factory videos you can see how they apply filler with a brush) forget the credit card thing you hear about.

Wipe it off when it starts to flash -- (when it gets dull) use a cotton rag, not burlap, wipe in a tight circular motion push the filler into the pores --- plan on two coats a day apart. No sanding should be required -- when completely dry buff the (very slight) residue off with a cotton rag using the same circular motion.

If you do this procedure correctly you are going to be wondering why so many seem to have much trouble filling.

Ken

Kenneth Michael Guitars est. 1978

Apr 05, 10 | 5:17 am
Freeman

Total Topics: 27
Total Posts: 668
Can't comment on these two products, but I'm finishing a guitar right now and did a little test strip with SM paste pore filler, CA glue and Z-poxy. I've sprayed a couple of coats of KTM-9 on in and in a week or so I'll sand and buff when I do the guitar. I've been asked at MIMF to do a tape pull test for adhesion between the filler and water based lacquer (mainly for the CA). I'll post pictures when I get it done.

I'm one of the ones who has had trouble with paste fillers - but it is certainly the easiest to apply (I have always squeegied it on, wiped most of it off and then lightly sanded). With two applications on some guitars I have still had pores show up in the final finish (nitro or waterbased). The CA was tricky to apply - it goes off very fast, but can be leveled pretty easily with a scraper. The z-poxy is much harder to level, required scraping and sanding to 320 after hardening, and a second coat. However, it is the most dramatic as far as making the wood grain pop (I'm doing this on figured koa). The paste filler has some color in it and definitely affects the overall color of the wood.

I'll post my complete results in a couple of weeks.

Apr 05, 10 | 8:12 am
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
As Freeman indicated you have to get the color of the paste filler correct --- straight out of the can seldom is the the right one --- regular artist oil paint in the tubes is a good choice for tinting. I simply don't know how to get that right without a test strip, as a matter of fact the whole process (like every thing else in life) requires some pratice of the new skill set. Sanding off the filler residue as opposed to "polishing/buffing" off the residue is where problems are likely to occur -- sanding tends to pull the filler right out of the pores, plus the filler is "much" softer than the wood so --- like soft grain it is removed faster, sometimes taking the filling operation back to square one.

Thinning with naptha (or correct solvent) is critical --- my results with non-thinned paste filler were marginal at best.

Ken

Kenneth Michael Guitars est. 1978

Apr 05, 10 | 8:49 am
Freeman

Total Topics: 27
Total Posts: 668
Some of the epoxy fillers seem to have a very slight amber cast, but boy did it bring out the figure in the koa. The big problem with epoxy (and CA for that matter) is that apparently you have to leave a very thin film on the surface of the wood, but not to break thru (or sand thru) to the wood itself, or you will get blotchy spots. In fact Mike Doolin recommends that if you do sand thru giving the spot a light was with epoxy mixed 50:50 with alcohol.

What I found was doing that scraping was very tricky - I would leave little ridges with the card I was using and on the sides I did get some sags. Curved surfaces like the back of the neck was really difficult. Then when I had all those little imperfections I had to carefully scrape with a razor blade and sand. Doolin says that ideally no sanding is necessary - sure was in my case.

I'm happy with the job but it did take two applications and many hours. Doing that with paste filler only took a few minutes.

fwiw - there is a thread at MIMF called "I'm not getting pore filling with epoxy" so I'm not the only one struggling with it.

Apr 05, 10 | 1:46 pm
Ken Hundley

Total Topics: 40
Total Posts: 2169
The alternative, Freeman, is to sand ALL of the pore filler off, as some instructions tell you. It depends on who you buy. That's what I do now with epoxy....sand it all off. Whats in the pores is what is left.

Apr 05, 10 | 2:01 pm
Kevin Sjostrand

Total Topics: 84
Total Posts: 981
I used epoxy on my last build, and I found it went very well. Sanded back to the wood so only the pores had epoxy in them. I have very little sanding to do, and there was no splotchy look to the wood. Hmmmmm.
One thing I liked was that I was not adding any color, or darkening the pores.

Kevin

Apr 05, 10 | 2:09 pm
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
I think we got off the thread guys -- I believe Pore o Pac and McFaddens is the topic.

Paste pore fillers have been the choice of Martin and other high end guitar builder's as well as top of the line furniture manufacturers for years and years. If applied correctly they do a wonderful job --- McFadden's is similar to Pore O Pac and is surely a high quality product. So if paste filler is your preference have no fears.

No doubt other filler "preferences" have produced good results.

Ken

Kenneth Michael Guitars est. 1978




Apr 05, 10 | 6:13 pm
longbow

Total Topics: 4
Total Posts: 74
Well... I'm doing two, the ooo28 I tried dry wall compound like the u-tube deal, I tried over and over on hog. but still added CA. and that did'nt even do it. On the next one I'm going wt. this and the 14.99 harbor frieght spay gun to do my OM. The costs are adding up And to get the pore o pack is a different store shipping ect. But I'm in this for the long hall, and I'll finish these and others if its the last thing I do. Guys talk about any filler you want, I'm so glad you guys pipped in, I just learned more....PS I can't get dry wall compound to work, it fills and stains but....Thanks everyone.

Apr 05, 10 | 10:33 pm
Ken Hundley

Total Topics: 40
Total Posts: 2169
Curious what went wrong with the Drywall, Dave. I want to try that at some point....

Apr 05, 10 | 11:19 pm
Tony_in_NYC

Total Topics: 29
Total Posts: 448
I know what went wrong with the drywall compound Ken H...he used it on a guitar and not drywall!! Longbow, I am helping my brother re-do his kitchen and we just hung the drywall. I could use some of that left over compound. We start taping this weekend.

Seriously though...I just began sanding my Sapele dread that I did not pore fill and much to my surprise, the pores are filled!!!
Dont ask me how, dont ask me why but they are. The finish is completely flat.
I did not fill the pores because I like the look of the pores in the finish, and I was really not crazy about actually filling the pores, so I skipped it. But, as it turns out, they are filled. I am assuming its because Sapele has small pores, but I really dont have a frame of reference since I dont work with wood ever. The pores on the Walnut kit I am doing do seem much larger. They wont be getting filled either btw. I wonder how they will end up...flat or visible. Time will tell.

Apr 06, 10 | 5:02 am
longbow

Total Topics: 4
Total Posts: 74
The back was sapele, side hog, The stuff looks like its working till you get lacquer on it, I tried it wt. shellac on first and later compound first. I thought the compound was old so I bought new stuff, I went out and got water based dye. Maybe sanding is the key Above ken's talking about sanding the pores out. Anyway it fills some of it, also put on CA to get most of the pores filled. You guys give it a try, I'm buying mcfadden's today....PS Tony I need my compound I stepped through my sisters attic and wreaked her house, But I bought her compound for XMAS..hum.. really to use on guitars.

Apr 08, 10 | 7:03 am
Tony_in_NYC

Total Topics: 29
Total Posts: 448
LOL
I am thinking of buying my wife a guitar kit for her birthday. I wonder if she wants to learn how to play....

Apr 08, 10 | 7:08 am
deadedith

Total Topics: 34
Total Posts: 165
Tony, that may be a great idea. It might rival the birthday when I gave my wife a new fly-fishing pole. She doesn't fish...:-)
Dave B

Apr 08, 10 | 8:39 am
Kevin Sjostrand

Total Topics: 84
Total Posts: 981
Dave,
You did that and you are still alive to tell it?
I may build a guitar for my wife, and she doesn't play either, however, she said she won't pay for it..or should I say the "budget" won't pay for it!!

Kevin

Apr 08, 10 | 9:05 am
Ken Hundley

Total Topics: 40
Total Posts: 2169
Do an inhouse "$100" guitar for her.....might be kinda fun!

Apr 08, 10 | 2:03 pm
Kevin Sjostrand

Total Topics: 84
Total Posts: 981
Ken,
Good idea. You got any scrap wood to get rid of?

Kevin

Apr 08, 10 | 2:27 pm
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
You guys are in dangerous territory -- I don't live on the edge but rather play it safe -- here's my wife guitar (in progress) Curly Spanish Cedar, Englemann Spruce, pin-less bridge.





Ken

Kenneth Michael Guitars est. 1978

Apr 08, 10 | 2:31 pm
Tony_in_NYC

Total Topics: 29
Total Posts: 448
Ken Cierp, Are you saying that my wife wont want the guitar kit for her birthday? Damn...looks like I will have to go to plan B. A new lawn mower.

Apr 09, 10 | 3:15 am
longbow

Total Topics: 4
Total Posts: 74
Tony, tell her you need sand paper and micro- mesh to clean the old lawn mower blade. Hum..maybe Dr. ducks ax waxs for the pull cord, or the ax.

Apr 09, 10 | 5:29 am
longbow

Total Topics: 4
Total Posts: 74
By the way Ken that is a cool looking bridge, I'd like to try one like that some day. The rest of it looks nice and clean also.

Apr 09, 10 | 5:36 am
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Tony --

Wife Gifts 101 --- building a guitar for a wife that does not play by most would be considered poor judgement. Buying a lawn more as a gift is a "death wish" ---- seek help now!

Ken

Apr 09, 10 | 6:20 am
Tony_in_NYC

Total Topics: 29
Total Posts: 448
LOL Thanks Ken.

Apr 09, 10 | 6:25 am
Ken Hundley

Total Topics: 40
Total Posts: 2169
My wife cried for joy when I bought her a new dishwasher. I thought she was gonna kill me at first.

Apr 09, 10 | 11:33 am



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