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Dave_E

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Hi All,

Who makes the best mold for a 000 or an OM guitar?

Nov 28, 08 | 8:45 pm
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
I'll say it --- "simply the best"

http://www.kennethmichaelguitars.com/masterwork.html


Ken

Kenneth Michael Guitars est. 1978

Nov 29, 08 | 5:25 am
llajoy

Total Topics: 6
Total Posts: 295
Dave, based on everything I read, not all 000's and OM's are exactly the same size. If you purchased a kit with prebent sides, you may want to check with the seller on what plan he used for the form or where he got his forms/mold. If the sides are not bent the KMG mold looks good. Looking at the link, these look to be similar to what Jonathan Kinkead show in his acoustic guitar building book, but they are better machined than the one I made. Blues Creek Guitars also sells nice solid body molds, and LMII recently started selling molds as well. If you want to make your own mold there have been a few threads on here were people have posted how to make your own.

Lance.


Nov 29, 08 | 6:43 am
llajoy

Total Topics: 6
Total Posts: 295
BTW I recently helped a friend glue on a top using the KMG Mega mold. The mold looks to take a little time to set up, but I liked the way it worked with rubber bands to glue the top. I also like the fact that is adjustable. If you are only doing this as a hobby and may switch sizes and styles, this might be a good option as well.

Lance.

Nov 29, 08 | 6:49 am
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Here is the really good news the KMG "Masterworks" OM/000 is available to match the Kinkead profile, Martin profile and the Scott Antes profile -- your choice. The KMG OM/000 kit is a Martin clone -- We manufacture our own parts so everything is 1st quality and accurately dimensioned. Image that stuff that fits! And Lance is correct for the shop or individual planning on more than one style the KMG Multi-Style mold is hard to beat. It was actually developed so we could do prototype models -- those doing their own profile designs will really like it.

Ken

Kenneth Michael Guitars est. 1978

Nov 29, 08 | 7:06 am
Gregg C

Total Topics: 23
Total Posts: 88
Ken,
Very cool mold !!I bought mine with my kit from Martin, seems to work well,
However yours seems more versitile when it omes to clamping.
Now I have something else to add to my "gotta have list"

Gregg

Nov 29, 08 | 7:09 am
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Hi Gregg,
We have those single purpose molds as well -- "pro style" a full three inches deep, profiled inside and out so one can use standard clamps if the side need a little shaping, with flat "half joiners" so there is a unobstructed surface to aide in the clamping of the neck and tail blocks.

Ken

Kenneth Michael Guitars est. 1978


Nov 29, 08 | 7:35 am
Gregg C

Total Topics: 23
Total Posts: 88
Ken,
I saw you ebay store,
Great stuff,
I saw the Martin D-28 mold, (single purpose)
I'll plan to buy that one, I'm some-what of a "D" Style Martin nut so
that one will work for me.
Also I'm looking forward to the assembly.
Now if I can just find that lottery ticket...
Gregg

Nov 29, 08 | 8:04 am
blues creek guitars Authorized Martin Repair Ctr

Total Topics: 52
Total Posts: 1011
I make the molds for CF Martin. It matters not who's mold but that you use one. They will take your building to next level and give you repeatability
john

Nov 29, 08 | 8:35 am
Gregg C

Total Topics: 23
Total Posts: 88
So true John !!
I can't imagine building without one.
Gregg

Nov 29, 08 | 11:06 am
DonB

Total Topics: 20
Total Posts: 240
I also have Ken's Mega Mold and it is incredibly convenient to be able to place in different shaped sides to work on.
Also this frees up my other molds as well.

Don

Nov 29, 08 | 11:24 am
Adaboy

Total Topics: 64
Total Posts: 509
Ken,

I really like your Masterwork Guitar Mold System you linked to above. From your coment above, I assume if you buy the Masterwork Mold profiled for your kit, it will be the Martin profile. Assuming this is true, if you wanted to use the same mold for a future scratch build, does anyone have plans available that follow the profile on the mold that goes with your kit?

Nov 30, 08 | 5:02 pm
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
I have a Masterworks molds to match the Scot Antes OM plan, Martin OM/000, and Kinkead OM. We have the Martin OM/000 brace pattern Stencil which is all you really need.

Ken

Nov 30, 08 | 6:31 pm
Adaboy

Total Topics: 64
Total Posts: 509
FYI, Michael Payne says about his plans:

"My body shape, length, depth and sound hole is to Martin specs. My bracing is a simular patter but differnt in X angle, brace thickness, tone bar location and sound hole bracing but not by much."

Michael's plans are available from StewMac.

Dec 01, 08 | 11:29 am
Dennis Weatherly

Total Topics: 73
Total Posts: 651
I built my own mold for my Martin 000 kit. I used the outline already drawn on the top for the body shape and built up multiple layers of 3/4" plywood to get the thickness I wanted. John Hall at Blues Creek Guitars provided the nice clamp hardware for each end.

In the end, I have a mold that's about as nice as a commercially available one. But when I figure in the time it took to build it, the router bit I destroyed while making the laminations and the cost of the other supplies, I am not sure it was worth it. I enjoyed the process (well, not the router bit destruction part) but I spent a lot of my time that could have gone towards guitar construction. John and Ken both offer excellent molds for a fair price.

Dec 01, 08 | 11:44 am
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Michael Payne's OM plan "is not" a Martin design -- only similar, like Willis', Kinkead's, and Antes' OM's.

Ken

Dec 01, 08 | 11:58 am
Adaboy

Total Topics: 64
Total Posts: 509
Ken, do they follow the Martin design?

Dec 01, 08 | 1:29 pm
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Each has a little different profile --- I don't have the Payne drawing in our shop but it definately is not even close as far as brace pattern and the waist curve is tighter. I can tell that from the mini drawings on-line. Note that there is no reason you can't use a Martin brace pattern with the Antes OM plan. As a matter of fact that is what I have recommended to many builders. The Antes OM bracing scheme is (from my view) much too heavy for a small guitar that is likely to be strung with lights or Xlights. Again just my opinion --- "to build it right -- you must build it light"

Ken

Dec 01, 08 | 1:58 pm
Dennis Weatherly

Total Topics: 73
Total Posts: 651
The other thing to watch is the scale length. If I remember correctly, my copy of the Antes drawing is 24.9" scale while my 000-18 kit is 25.4" scale. Both are 14-fret necks. BE SURE to measure and set your braces and bridge according the scale length of your kit!

Dec 01, 08 | 2:04 pm
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Dennis I have to thank you for a great idea --- I have been working on my Martin OM/000 CAD renderring recently with the intent of publishing it. Your comment made it clear that I should have all the variations on the drawing as well. Modern bracing, pre-war bracing oval sound hole, cutaways and as you mentioned the two scale lengths and associated positioning for all the different combo's.

Ken

Dec 01, 08 | 2:23 pm
Adaboy

Total Topics: 64
Total Posts: 509
On NOW you say you may be publishing yours! All I wanted was a plan that would match the Masterwork mold that goes with your kit.......and now I have a $25 plan ordered that I now find out won't match! <smile> Oh well.......

Dec 01, 08 | 2:38 pm
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Sorry about that -- anyway its a back burner project so it will be awhile.

Ken

Dec 01, 08 | 2:56 pm
Bill Cory

Total Topics: 158
Total Posts: 3584
Ken -- That sounds great. When, and in what format, will it be published? Will it be downloadable as a PDF so we can buy it and go print it at Kinko's, or are you going to have it printed?



Dec 01, 08 | 2:57 pm
Adaboy

Total Topics: 64
Total Posts: 509
Bill, that's not a bad idea......Ken could sell the plan without spending his time on printouts......and save the shipping costs as well.......and the plans could be rolled instead of folded.

Ken, including the different bracing patterns and scale lengths is a great idea! Would set your plan apart as well.

Dec 01, 08 | 3:14 pm
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Actually, I have been shopping for a reasonably priced used Monochrome plotter -- the shipping fees are murder! I checked out having prints made at Office Max but only one in store Michigan does plotting. Never thought of Kinkos. I don't think I am going to do the downloadables. Isn't there a chance that every guitar builder on the planet could end up with a free drawing?

Ken

Dec 01, 08 | 3:15 pm
Adaboy

Total Topics: 64
Total Posts: 509
It would take some web work/design but you could send a key to those who purchase that allows a one time download. The web application could read a file that is set up where you can edit it......and add keys that allow a one time download from whoever enters the key. Of couse this only one idea.......probably 100s of ways to do this.

Dec 01, 08 | 3:23 pm
Dennis Weatherly

Total Topics: 73
Total Posts: 651
Ken, you could burn the PDF file (perhaps a DXF as well?) onto a CD and ship that. Then you control the distribution to some extent and the purchaser can take it to the appropriate printing shop in their area.

Dec 01, 08 | 3:44 pm
Bill Cory

Total Topics: 158
Total Posts: 3584
Ken -- I feel the same way, and that is why my books aren't sold online as PDFs. I think you're right about everybody eventually owning your plans: There's a luthier in France who publishes his plans as PDFs, freely available, and I have printed them all, which is where the Kinko's info below came from.

I believe you can have your formats printed at the Kinko's pretty easily -- only problem is that they charge by the foot of three-foot wide paper -- here in Colo Springs, the charge is something like $2.50 per linear foot. Actually, if your plan is 4 feet long and you pay ten bucks for each one, you could just have ten printed and sell them for $29.95 each (or more) plus shipping and you'd almost cover your printing expense with just five sales for each printing.

Having a lot of them printed is cost prohibitive -- you have to get into at least the hundreds before the unit price goes down much. Maybe fine for LMII and SM, but not us little guys. I've run into that with my kit books: It's expensive, unit-wise, to do the "Print On Demand" process, but it impossible for me to have 1000 of them printed offset just to reduce the unit cost by 40%.

Bill

Dec 02, 08 | 5:18 am
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Thanks Bill,

I am really leaning toward the purchase of a plotter -- once I am clear what my liabilities are, I think I'll publish some other stuff as well. Like the Spartan Side Benders, Vacuum Clamping system, Powered contouring disk etc. I simple don't have the space to manufacture all that kind of (big) stuff so getting the drawings out there may work OK?

Ken

Dec 02, 08 | 5:32 am
Bill Cory

Total Topics: 158
Total Posts: 3584
Yeah, I agree. Most of us want to build our machines if we can -- lots more fun that way!

Hey, maybe you can find a plan for bulding a plotter ...

Dec 02, 08 | 5:46 am
Bill Cory

Total Topics: 158
Total Posts: 3584
Gee, thinking about that ... how about adapting a CNC cutting head to become a plotter drawing head. Then you could use the same skills and program to draw and to cut ...

Maybe somebody has already done it?

Dec 02, 08 | 5:47 am
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
As a matter of fact when I completed my first "homebrew" CNC machine I actually did mount a Sharpie to Z axis and did some lettering for the first tests. You may be correct perhaps there is a print head adapter? Keeping the paper flat would be an issue. My most challenging problem is trying to do 36 hours of work in these short 24 hour days.

Ken

Dec 02, 08 | 6:09 am
Adaboy

Total Topics: 64
Total Posts: 509
Ken, rumor is you lay in bed most every night.......if you could just cut that out....... <smile>

Dec 02, 08 | 6:19 am
Dennis Weatherly

Total Topics: 73
Total Posts: 651
"Keeping the paper flat would be an issue."

A two word suggestion for you, Ken: vacuum table

Dec 02, 08 | 7:28 am
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Got that for all three machines -- works good for solid wood -- not so sure with paper since it will suck in little dimples all over the place. I am sure it could be done. Thank you for all the good suggestions -- still think a black and white plotter is my best/ most cost effective choice.

Ken

Dec 02, 08 | 8:03 am
Ken Hundley

Total Topics: 40
Total Posts: 2169
http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/sys/941558841.html

http://chicago.craigslist.org/nwc/sys/942319972.html

You're 2.5-3 hours from me. I'd drive it over for a discount on a couple of necks and tops......he he.

Dec 02, 08 | 6:39 pm
Ken Cierp

Total Topics: 58
Total Posts: 2262
Hi Ken,
Thanks for thinking about me -- But I have bead on a few of those closer to me. As for necks and tops, drop me an Email I can usually work out a package if I know what you need. I am getting very close to the final programming and fixturing for my new line of Martin heel and Gibson heel five piece necks. The new shop is almost complete. However, my Engineering guy works out of Texas and the summer hurricanes put him out of business for months.

Ken

Dec 03, 08 | 4:18 am



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